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Stule
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 119
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 Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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Hey!
Thanks for the feedback.
As for an official rule for off hand, there isn't one (and I own all the books. Thanks Gry!).
If you find one, please let me know.
As for the -3D, yeah it's high, but fighting with two weapons isn't easy (I know, I tried  ). In my game I don't want everyone grabbing two swords or Lightsabers and becoming Buckaroo Bonzai. So if you want to be good with two weapons (at least in my game), you have to buy the advance skill.
As for the -1D for the main hand, using two melee weapons, the off hand tends to throw your main hand off abit (Again, expierience ).
I thought of lowering it to just -1D for main hand and -2D for off hand but a person with high Melee (8D+) can use the weapons pretty well, so the Advanced Skills are kinda unneccesary.
(-1D/-2D)
Melee 8D
Main: 7D
Off: 6D
(-1D, -3D)
Melee 8D
Main: 7D
Off: 5D
This is when you make 3 Attacks in a round.
Melee 8D with one sword
Main: 3 Attacks at 6D
Melee 8D with two swords.
Main: 3 Attacks at 5D
Off: 3 Attacks at 3D
Basically you get more chances to try to hit your opponent but you sacrifice some accuracy.
Don't forget that the difficulty on both weapons goes up one level when your using them two handed.
If you had 10D Melee, it would look like this.
3 Attacks
Melee 10D with one sword:
Main: 3 Attacks at 8D
Melee 10D with two swords:
Main: 3 Attacks with 7D
Off: 3 Attacks with 5D
Now if you learn the advance skill, then you lose the -1D for main and -3D for off.
3 Attacks for the round.
Melee 8D with one sword.
Main: 3 Attacks at 6D.
(A) Two Weapon: Melee 8D with 2 swords
Main: 3 attacks at 6D
Off: 3 attacks at 6D
So it makes sence about using two swords and it even makes sence about buying the Advance Skills.
Hopefully this helps. |
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Hellcat
Grand Moff
Joined: 29 Jul 2004
Posts: 11921
Location: New England
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | | Hellcat wrote: | | But the point for making the double-bladed lightsaber an advanced skill over increasing the difficulty is that the double-bladed lightsaber requires a whole different set of movements in order to use it when both blades are on. You don't hold it the same and you don't use it in the same way, making it a wholely different beast. |
But there is also a precedent for this under the melee weapons skill. A halberd is a whole different beast from a cutlas, yet they both do use the same skill. I personally don't think the difference between a saber and twin bladed saber is as different as for the weapons in the melee weapon skill, the difference with those weapons is the differing target numbers to reflect ease of use and movements. I also feel that more and more fragmentizing of skills takes away from the cinimatic feel of the game, requiring more paperwork, and that is one reason I prefer D6 to D20 in general. |
Last time I checked, a halberd was nothing more than a polearm axe with a spear point for thrusting and a pick or hammer beak on the opposite side of the axe blade, all at one end of the pole. Meaning that while you can injure yourself with the pole, your not as likely to kill yourself since your going to have the deadly end point away from you. Not the same with a double-bladed lightsaber where the deadly end is on both ends.
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 1:13 am Post subject: |
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| Hellcat wrote: |
Last time I checked, a halberd was nothing more than a polearm axe with a spear point for thrusting and a pick or hammer beak on the opposite side of the axe blade, all at one end of the pole. Meaning that while you can injure yourself with the pole, your not as likely to kill yourself since your going to have the deadly end point away from you. Not the same with a double-bladed lightsaber where the deadly end is on both ends. |
Yes, and the lightsaber skill already takes into acount that you can be injured by the blades, and increasing the difficulty for a twin saber increases the likely hood of it happening, thus reflecting the greater danger. As for the point I made about halberds vs cutlass it was about them being totally different beasts and falling in the same skill, which could also aply to a large number of the melee weapons, it was in regards to them being to different fighting techniques with different movements.
@Stule: with the newer post I understand more now where we are differing on 2 handed weapons. I count each action by each weapon as a seperate action, thus I count 2 attacks with dual melee as 4 actions, or -3D main, -4D off hand. I count the main advantage to multiple weapons is that two attacks can be made so close together as to take them both before proceeding to the next character's phase (especially with blasters), which can be a huge advantage. As for the off handed rule I am sure I read it somewhere in a WEG book, as when I first started playing the internet didn't exist yet. If I do find it I will post the reference to the book and page for all, if anyone else has found it, or knows it, please post? Almost every WEG group I played in from 1990-1996 used this rule for offhanded as well. |
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Esjs
Captain
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 636
Location: Denver, CO, USA
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 1:32 am Post subject: |
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hmmmm...
Melee, difficulty=heroic, if you fail by more that 1 you hit yourself 
And you hold them very carefully. |
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Stule
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 119
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| Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 2:04 am Post subject: |
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Kage,
Cool! If you find it let em know. I have checked the 1st, 2nd, and R+E and have found nothing about the off hand.
After your explanation, I am seeing more clearly what you are talking about.
After your declaration, you could attack twice in your first actions instead of just once.
So I was thinking of changing the off hand to -1D for main and -2D for off.
What do you think?
Should it only be -1D or -2D for the off hand, and should there be a penalty for the main, like -1D?
Wait a sec....
Is this what your talking about?
Should it that your main has no penalties, and -1D for Off.
Then if a person declares 4 attacks and he has an 8D Melee it would look like this:
Melee 8D with two swords
Main: 2 Attacks at 5D
Off: 2 Attacks at 4D
The attacks would be made in 2 rounds.
1st action: 2 Attacks (5D, 4D)
2nd Action: 2 Attacks (5D, 4D)
Is this what you mean? |
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Volar the Healer
Jedi
Joined: 04 Aug 2003
Posts: 664
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: Double Bladed Lightsaber Skill |
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| Stule wrote: | | I have a player that wants to use a double bladed lightsaber (groan)...What do you guys think? |
Here's my take: Double Lightsaber Difficulty: Very Difficult
That's it.
No bonuses of any kind, no special rules.
Just give lots of cool descriptions.
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Argamoth
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| No, I'd give it a damage bonus or allow 2 attacks for 1. It's an exotic weapon, and it must have some advantage or else it would be a useless weapon. |
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:48 am Post subject: |
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It should at least have a +1D to fry bacon with! Just think how many strips can line a double blade!
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TheFamousTommyZ
Ensign
Joined: 29 May 2005
Posts: 40
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Eh, I'd at least go with a parry bonus. Lemme rephrase that, should I ever get a Star Wars game going...the double bladed lightsaber will be worth at least a decent parry bonus. |
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Stule
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 119
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:09 am Post subject: |
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I think it should have the following:
Saberstaff
Difficulty: Very Difficult (30)
DG: 5D
The user can do one of the following:
1) User can make an additional attack (at -1D for offhand) on the same segment that their normal attack goes off.
Ex: I declare 2 Actions. I will attack twice with my Saberstaff. I have Lightsaber 7D. That would be 6D with one attack, and 5D with second and they would both go off on my 1st Action Phase.
2) User can get +1D to Parry.
This would make the Saberstaff a pretty formidable weapon. |
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:46 am Post subject: |
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If it's going to have a higher difficulty, or need a new skill as some wish to do, then it should have an advantage or two to offset this fact and maintain some balance. There are official write ups for Double bladed sabers out there, and they raise the difficulty, and give bonuses to parry.
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Boomer
Captain
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 688
Location: Terra Sol
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 12:44 am Post subject: |
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A friend of mine had a write up for the Double-Saber. He made it before episode 1 came out, long ago when it was called by many diffrent names in countless stories. Lucas was giving many fans what they wanted by showing them what they dreamed of onscreen.
The problem... I do not have the rules for it with me. I should look into it. |
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