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Problems with star destroyers being ... destroyed
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's just calculating the route. I think what he was on about was how long will it take from leaving atmosphere to where you are in a position to jump cause of the larger gravity plane of the planet.
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DougRed4
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, you're right. I remember reading that not that long ago, too. Can't remember where it was, though.
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Methedor
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

50 Space Units from planet to make a hyper jump. Its under the heading: Benchmarks
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jmanski
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I remember an average of 50 space units being given as a safe distance in 2e, IIRC.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jmanski wrote:
I remember an average of 50 space units being given as a safe distance in 2e, IIRC.

That's the 2E rule (page 110 of the 2E Rulebook). 2R&E made it less specific by offering the "very rough" guideline that it would take five minutes for a ship to travel from orbit to a safe hyperdrive jump distance (page 116 of the 2R&E rulebook).

There is, in addition, the stats for the Interdictor in Wanted by Cracken, in which the difficulty of jumping to hyperspace increases the closer a ship is to the planet / gravity well.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jmanski wrote:
I remember an average of 50 space units being given as a safe distance in 2e, IIRC.


So an average PC Freighter (SU6) would take around 9 rounds of travel at cruise speed to reach the cut off.
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Edheldun
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the transport was still dodging fire from the ISD, could you stack combined actions for the ISD turbolasers?
The commander of each gun crew rolls command for a combined action to operate the turbolaser. Figure four gunners with 4D+2 capitalship gunnery and the turbolaser, as a whole, rolls 5D+3 to hit a target. Plus the turbolasers have 4D fire control
Then the captain of the ship is coordinating that fire in some sort of grid. If all 20 forward facing batteries fired, it could potentially add 6D+2 to the capitalship gunnery roll.
It's definitely a stretch of RAW, but I think it goes with the idea of the empire relying on discipline, tight command and overwhelming numbers to get results.
It also only works this way on a single target. In a pitched battle, where each gun is targeting a different fighter, they wouldn't be coordinated in the same way by the captain. So, fighters would still be hard to hit in that sort of situation.
Han had like 10D in YT-1300 per the New Hope galaxy guide, and the falcon had 2D maneuverability, and he still ran as fast as he could.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Combined fire is certainly reasonable to expect from a cap ship shooting a freighter, but then you get into overkill damage.
A standard ISD is what 6d damage as is. +6d for scale difference, +4 to 6d from combined fire, and you are looking at close to 20d of damage IF you do hit.
While combined fire is a great equalizer, it can get overwhelming.
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atgxtg
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We had a few of house rules that helped here.

1) Capital ship guns can be fired at low power/counterbattery mode. This basically meant that there were fired at starfighter scale. It made it far more likely to get a hit, but also more likely that a snub fighter could survive the hit.

2) Rather than rolling attacks for all of the capital ship's guns, we came up with a FlaK rating. This was the average attack roll for the weapon. For instance, a gun with 4D fire control fired by a gunner with 4D+2 skill would have a FlaK value of 30.

Flak would be increased by 1 per additional gun being combined, and reduced for multiple actions (per normal).
The pilot had to beat the FlaK value to avoid being hit. .

The nice thing about the FlaK rule was that it prevented the game from bogging down when the GM had to handled the capital ship attacks. It also reduced the chance PCs from getting wiped out by extras who just happened to roll very lucky.

3) We let FlaK target spaces, so that ships that flew through those spaces could get attacked. In those cases only 1 hit was achieved per gun firing at that space (multiple actions also allowed more hits), and hit were determined in order of the lowest piloting rolls on up..
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shootingwomprats
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Star Destroyers do have anti-starfighter capability. They have laser cannons as well as turbolasers. The turbolaser batteries are for anti-capship action and fixed targets.

Correction: ImpStar Deuces have them.
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Edheldun
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atgxtg, that's a cool way to do it. Definitely more elegant than what I was thinking of.
I feel like whatever rule is used though should take the commander's skill into account. I can't remember exactly when it happens, but I remember an example where Thrawn directed the Chimera's fire to destroy some A-wings and did a really good job of it.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking up all the imp/reb cap ships i see the following with SF scale weapon (just the # of and their damage listed):
IMP
Nebulon B - 12 laser cannons 2d damage (What were these supposed to be a threat against??)

Corellian Gunship - 4 quad lasers, 5d damage

Acclaimator - 24 point laser cannons, 4d+1 damage (why the heck does this older ship have better lasers than the Neb B?)

Tartan patrol craft - 20 laser cannons, 7d damage (more than an Xwing!)

Vindicator heavy cruiser - 20 point defense lasers, 4d damage

Imp mark III - 36 double turbo lasers, 6d damage

Lancer assault frigate - 20 quad laser cannons 4d damage (why lower than the Tartan and corellian gunship?)

Abolisher interdictor cruiser - 20 turbolaser cannons, 7d damage

Executor class SSD - 200 point defense lasers, 3d damage (not that much more than the Neb B. And 1d+1 worse than those on an Acclaimator.

KDY escort frigate - 7 laser cannons, 2d damage (again, not a threat even to uglies and equal to a Tie fighter??)

Broad sword heavy troop transport - 10 laser annon 2d+2 damage (WTF here.. this troop transport can barely cause a 'stun effect' on its own tie recons!)

Sovereign SSD - 500 turbo laser batteries, 5d damage

Eclipse SSD - 500 turbo laser batteries, 5d damage (so a battery has the same damage as a quad laser??)

REB
Neb B Medical frigate - 8 laser cannons, 2d damage, exactly the same as the regular Neb B other than 4 less guns!.

CC-7700 Frigate- 24 laser cannons, 3d damage

Agave picket ship (new republic time frame) - 4 laser cannons, 5d damage

Corona frigate (new rep) - 10 laser cannons, 4d damage

CC-9600 frigate (New rep) - 20 ion cannons 5d damage

Warrior class gunship and Sacheen escort frigate (new rep) - 8 laser cannons, 5d damage

Defender class assault carrier, Majestic heavy cruiser and Endurance fleet carrier (new rep) - 20 laser cannons, 5d damage

Rendili stardrive republic class star destroyer (New rep) - 20 ion cannons, 5d damage

Mon Cal Viscount star defender - (NJO wizards website) - 100 point defense laser cannon batteries, 3d damage

So, not really that many who Do have SF scale weapons, and those that do vary greatly from just token defenses, to mass batteries..
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atgxtg
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

shootingwomprats wrote:
Star Destroyers do have anti-starfighter capability. They have laser cannons as well as turbolasers. The turbolaser batteries are for anti-capship action and fixed targets.

Correction: ImpStar Deuces have them.


Some capital ships do. D20 was a bit better about this.
Embarassed What garkhal wrote!


Last edited by atgxtg on Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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atgxtg
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Edheldun wrote:
Atgxtg, that's a cool way to do it. Definitely more elegant than what I was thinking of.
I feel like whatever rule is used though should take the commander's skill into account. I can't remember exactly when it happens, but I remember an example where Thrawn directed the Chimera's fire to destroy some A-wings and did a really good job of it.


I have the thing done up in more detail somewhere. Combined fire did account for the commander's skill.

One of the other things I added was a snap-shot rule, where a gunner could interrupt a ship's movement to fire as a reaction. That was to allow for things like getting a shot off on a ship that flies right across you fire arc, or to allow a capital ship to shoot at a closing starfighter before it can launch torpedoes or ram.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

atgxtg wrote:

Embarassed What garkhal wrote!


Thanks. If i wanted to, i could have included all the ships from the other factions inc the separatists.. but figured we stick to imp/reb/new rep.
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