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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
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Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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 Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | And any decent/respectable gambling establishment would be on the look out for those sorts of articles of clothing. |
But this presupposes that a gambler would only use it for gambling. Hell, just about any character could take advantage of this. Even if just to smuggle a set of basic tools (lock picks) or a handcuff key or the like. A smuggler's coat would be less of a restriction on the character classes that make use of it than it would the sheer ability to smuggle small objects past guards and the like. |
That is a valid point.. Though if someone got put in handcuffs, wouldn't that also mean they got searched? Or if locked up in a cell, wouldn't they have been stripped of most clothing?? SO having that hidden compartment to contain the key you pick pocketed won't do you much good if the coat got taken from you..
| ForbinProject wrote: | | shootingwomprats wrote: | | ForbinProject wrote: | | The whole point behind the concept of a Smugglers Coat or clothing is the camouflage of hiding in plain sight. The clothes will NOT stand out in a crowd. The clothes will be no different in appearance than the regular clothes worn in a given location. |
From what I read when I created the stats was its a piece of clothing with tons of pockets of all sorts of sizes, strapped, zippered, buttoned, etc. So many of them in fact that the idea a few will only get a cursory inspection or plain missed. |
I understand, but my point is that this concept can be applied to any article of clothing. Under garments to outer garments, shoes, belts, hats, and buckles. Furthermore the existence of the pockets don't have to be blatantly obvious to casual observation. |
Maybe, but the fact he ha all those pockets, some visible, some hidden, i can easily see some establishments having him be required to 'check the coat'..
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ForbinProject
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Joined: 16 May 2016
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:01 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | Maybe, but the fact he ha all those pockets, some visible, some hidden, i can easily see some establishments having him be required to 'check the coat'.. |
A gambler intending to cheat isn't going to wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets. He's going to wear one with concealed pockets. |
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Zarn
Force Spirit
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Or, you know, a gambler that is intending to cheat might wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets - and then make a show of removing it and placing it out of reach. So that it is less likely that the one with concealed pockets is discovered. |
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ForbinProject
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Zarn wrote: | | Or, you know, a gambler that is intending to cheat might wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets - and then make a show of removing it and placing it out of reach. So that it is less likely that the one with concealed pockets is discovered. |
The success of that ploy would depend on the establishment. The key to being successful at cheating in casinos is being inconspicuous, unless of course there's another type of scam being run and the role of the gambler in question is to draw attention from somewhere else. |
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MrNexx
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Joined: 25 Mar 2016
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Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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| ForbinProject wrote: | | Zarn wrote: | | Or, you know, a gambler that is intending to cheat might wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets - and then make a show of removing it and placing it out of reach. So that it is less likely that the one with concealed pockets is discovered. |
The success of that ploy would depend on the establishment. The key to being successful at cheating in casinos is being inconspicuous, unless of course there's another type of scam being run and the role of the gambler in question is to draw attention from somewhere else. |
Solo's Eleven?
(haven't read it, but shelved it in our library and considered grabbing it)
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
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Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:10 am Post subject: |
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| ForbinProject wrote: | | Zarn wrote: | | Or, you know, a gambler that is intending to cheat might wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets - and then make a show of removing it and placing it out of reach. So that it is less likely that the one with concealed pockets is discovered. |
The success of that ploy would depend on the establishment.. |
OR how well he rolled on his Con skill!!
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ForbinProject
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 7:32 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | ForbinProject wrote: | | Zarn wrote: | | Or, you know, a gambler that is intending to cheat might wear a garment with dozens of visible pockets - and then make a show of removing it and placing it out of reach. So that it is less likely that the one with concealed pockets is discovered. |
The success of that ploy would depend on the establishment.. |
OR how well he rolled on his Con skill!! |
In my world you can use Con against the dealers/croupiers, but not against casino surveillance which is a much more advanced version of the the Greco Player Tracker seen in Oceans 13.
Add to that, the organics working for casino surveillance are paid to be paranoid of everyone, you'll already be facing penalties, and if the casino is run by a criminal organization the paranoia and skill to spot cons goes up by an order of magnitude. |
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Error
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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I still think an "analog" Smuggler's Garment X would be impossible to spot even with advanced electronic surveillance, and even with detailed visual examination of the garment. By analog, I mean no forms of active sensor baffling. The only bells and whistles it has are very difficult to find pockets.
Garments with active sensor baffling are a different animal entirely and would be much easier to detect, particularly if the visual or sensor data implies active countermeasures. These are the garments you get turned away at the door for wearing*, generally unless you agree to play without them. In some jurisdictions, the garment is never returned to you when you leave, while in others it is. Regardless of your decision, your face is photographed and mapped, and is generally submitted to some variety of planetary (or even interplanetary) database.
* Not only at gambling establishments, but at some bars, restaurants, political functions, some retail stores, and other places and/or events.
I feel like the only places you'd be safe wearing Smuggler's Garments with active countermeasures built into them would be not at casinos, but side gambling establishments, low-level end-of-work-week sabbacc gatherings, and even games played on the street. But if you're playing games like these, you're probably not increasing your money a whole lot since the games' stakes are often so low.
Analog Smuggler's Garments are the way to go. You can use them all the way to the top, and you don't get your face imprinted in some database somewhere.
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ForbinProject
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| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Error wrote: | | I still think an "analog" Smuggler's Garment X would be impossible to spot even with advanced electronic surveillance, and even with detailed visual examination of the garment. By analog, I mean no forms of active sensor baffling. The only bells and whistles it has are very difficult to find pockets. |
I agree, but some keep mentioning many visible pockets, which I argue will draw attention and extra scrutiny. All it takes is a simple message to remote security to keep an eye on table 14, there's a guy with lots of pockets on his jacket. Watch his hands and track where he goes. |
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Error
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:37 am Post subject: |
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A Smuggler's Garment would probably have pockets wherever other garments of that style would normally have them. A vest would have a watch pocket for example, and a pair of pants could have four main pockets (like Earth jeans) maybe with little side pockets for various things (again, the watch pocket of Earth as example). Take a look at cargo shorts even.
But it would also have hidden ones as well. Best to complete the disguise, right?
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garhkal
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:44 am Post subject: |
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So would it be a pick pockets roll or a hide/sneak roll to get stuff in and out of those hidden pockets?
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Error
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:55 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | So would it be a pick pockets roll or a hide/sneak roll to get stuff in and out of those hidden pockets? |
Depends on the pocket, I guess, but I'm not going to map out every single pocket (hidden or not) in one of my PC's garments. A heroic blind Pickpocket roll might turn up something from one of the hidden pockets, but if you're using those pockets for gambling sleight of hand, who cares? Your intrepid pickpocket now holds a skifter, which he could get caught with and kicked out for.
If you're trying to sneak up on someone to pickpocket them, that's where your Sneak roll goes. Your Pickpocket roll is against his or her Hide, perhaps a number as established earlier or as re-rolled against you (GM's option). The GM may also add or subtract difficulty levels depending on your surroundings.
Pretty simple stuff.
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ForbinProject
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | So would it be a pick pockets roll or a hide/sneak roll to get stuff in and out of those hidden pockets? |
I had to double check the wording of both Pick Pockets and Hide skills, and both would work as a base skill, but I'd recommend to a player in one of my campaigns to pick one and specialize in sleight of hand. |
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garhkal
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Joined: 17 Jul 2005
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Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| Error wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | So would it be a pick pockets roll or a hide/sneak roll to get stuff in and out of those hidden pockets? |
Depends on the pocket, I guess, but I'm not going to map out every single pocket (hidden or not) in one of my PC's garments. A heroic blind Pickpocket roll might turn up something from one of the hidden pockets, but if you're using those pockets for gambling sleight of hand, who cares? Your intrepid pickpocket now holds a skifter, which he could get caught with and kicked out for.
If you're trying to sneak up on someone to pickpocket them, that's where your Sneak roll goes. Your Pickpocket roll is against his or her Hide, perhaps a number as established earlier or as re-rolled against you (GM's option). The GM may also add or subtract difficulty levels depending on your surroundings.
Pretty simple stuff. |
You are misunderstanding me. I was on about for the one WEARING said jacket/trench coat.. Which skill he would use to get something out unnoticed, so as to avoid suspicion.
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ForbinProject
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | You are misunderstanding me. I was on about for the one WEARING said jacket/trench coat.. Which skill he would use to get something out unnoticed, so as to avoid suspicion. |
That's what I thought you were asking and from the way Pick Pockets and Hide are worded either skill should work, but I still think a specialization in Sleight of Hand should give a bonus because it focuses on the characters ability to move items around unnoticed while under close scrutiny. |
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