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Handheld Shields
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Naaman
Rear Admiral
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Joined: 29 Jul 2011
Posts: 2237

PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kytross wrote:
Ninja-Bear wrote:
Nice concept Kytross. My question though is what’s the difference between Tay and Particle weapons? Do you have an example?


Ray shields block energy. Particle shields block physical. The exhaust port on the Death Star was only ray shielded, so it was possible to bypass that with a physical object, like a torpedo.

Page 126 of 2E R&E covers the difference between the two in space combat.

CRMcNeill, I felt that making the shield both ray and particle could be over powering. It needs some play testing.


To further reinforce what CRM is saying here, consider this question:

Are these "ray shields" different in nature than the ones in EpIII? Because if not, then Obi-Wan and Anakin (especially Anakin) should have known to just walk right through them.
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Kytross
Captain
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Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 630

PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naaman wrote:


To further reinforce what CRM is saying here, consider this question:

Are these "ray shields" different in nature than the ones in EpIII? Because if not, then Obi-Wan and Anakin (especially Anakin) should have known to just walk right through them.


In Episode 3 Lucas is contradicting himself from what we learned in Star Wars: A New Hope. It is only a line or two of dialogue, but General Dodonna makes the distinction between ray and particle shields clear. It is a vital point to the movie, what with it being the only vulnerability to the Death Star.

I picked up on the dialogue about ray shields in Ep 3 on premiere night and my shouted "WTF!" got everyone in the theatre looking at me. I was much quieter with my other problems with continuity in the film that night.

Personally, I use the explanation from the Lando Books to explain particle shields. It was explained here that shields are integrated with the hull, boosting the hull's resistance. Kind of like what they did in Star Trek Enterprise, polarizing the hull, or whatever the technobabble was.

CRM has mentioned the particle shields being part of the hull before, either in this thread or another. I am not doing the research right now, if you're really interested I can find it later when I have more time.

By extrapolation from what Dodonna said and what we see during the Death Star Trench run, particle shields do not need to travel through the hull. If the Empire could have particle shielded the thermal exhaust port, which is an open space, then particle shields can run over open spaces, outside of the hull. I would argue that when they are outside of a hull, particle shields do nothing to stop laser fire.


I still use ray shields as a reaction skill against laser weaponry. It makes sense to me. In my games, Laser Weapons have the longest range of any space based weaponry, and are by far the most common space based weaponry.

Tractor Beams have roughly half the range of lasers and ion cannons. They are more often on capital ships and I don't see them used in combat in most of my games. Though I do love innovative players.

Most private citizens don't want to drop their particle shields, and lose 2D from their hull code, to use torpedoes and missiles. Combining that with max range of torpedoes being short range for lasers and it is usually suicide to use projectiles, especially in the same scale. So projectiles are rarely used outside of military actions.

So we are left with ion cannon and laser weapons for space combat. I have stated elsewhere on these boards that Starfighter Ion cannons range should read 1-3/7/16, with 16 as the maximum range, not 36. I firmly believe this is a typo, as all the rest of the space weaponry, including other ion cannons, basically doubles from short to medium, and medium to long range except the starfighter ion cannon.

Hence why you have shields to deal directly with Laser Weapons. Wow, that was a long explanation for why I use ray shields. Sorry if I've derailed the thread too much.

On a side note, I will also allow people to improve both their ship's base hull code and their particle shield code, allowing for a maximum hull improvement of 2D+4 or 3D+1.
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Argentsaber
Lieutenant
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Joined: 07 Oct 2017
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naaman wrote:
Kytross wrote:
Ninja-Bear wrote:
Nice concept Kytross. My question though is what’s the difference between Tay and Particle weapons? Do you have an example?


Ray shields block energy. Particle shields block physical. The exhaust port on the Death Star was only ray shielded, so it was possible to bypass that with a physical object, like a torpedo.

Page 126 of 2E R&E covers the difference between the two in space combat.

CRMcNeill, I felt that making the shield both ray and particle could be over powering. It needs some play testing.


To further reinforce what CRM is saying here, consider this question:

Are these "ray shields" different in nature than the ones in EpIII? Because if not, then Obi-Wan and Anakin (especially Anakin) should have known to just walk right through them.


I always thought that particle shields could be channeled through a ray shield in exactly the same way they can be through a ship's hull. Wouldn't that explain the reactor shielding in Phantom Menace as well?

While this might at first look like a contradiction due to the Death Star's exhaust port not being particle shielded when it easily could be.. I think if it were the exhaust wouldn't be able to escape.. something you really want if your reactor is so big I would think.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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Joined: 05 Apr 2010
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the first film, Ray Shields are only mentioned once, during the Dodonna briefing. On both the Millennium Falcon and the X-Wings and Y-Wings during the Battle of Yavin, they are specifically called Deflectors or Deflector Screens. It's unfortunate but not surprising that WEG misused terminology, then used the inference to make an odd in-game ruling.

My take has long been that what WEG called Particle Shields are actually Navigation Shields, generated in close to the Hull as a defense against radiation, micro-meteorites and such, which also provides limited protection against attacks.

Deflectors, on the other hand, are projected out a meter or so from the ship's Hull, and provide similar protection against all forms of damage. In addition, their distance from the Hull allows them to be angled against attacks, so as to provide added protection based on how well the shield operator rolls his Starship Shields skill. IMO, this is what Chewie was doing during the escape from the Death Star in ANH, angling the Falcon's deflectors against the TIE Fighters' strafing runs so as to maximize their deflective properties.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
Amazing. Everything you just said was wrong.
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