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Learning 1E running Tatooine Manhunt (Game Report)
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Episode V: EXPLORING THE WASTES

After executing the prisoners they kept back at the ship, the party leaves for the desert guided by Arno, on the old man's skiff.


They kill the prisoners in cold blood? Even the Force users?
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Oh, I did narrate the cut-away scene at the Relentless to get a sense of how it affects the gameplay. It felt really weird to the players, to see what their characters didn't see. They immediately started joking about having had a collective "force vision". It totally broke the immersion.

I decided not to use cut-away scenes again. It didn't work for me or my group.


I don't use them, either.
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Zulgyan wrote:
Episode V: EXPLORING THE WASTES

After executing the prisoners they kept back at the ship, the party leaves for the desert guided by Arno, on the old man's skiff.


They kill the prisoners in cold blood? Even the Force users?


The Force User didn't take part in the decision. It was Kyle (a Rebel) and Kal Urbo (a Mercenary) who deemed that is was too risky to leave the ship alone with the prisoners while they left for the desert. They concluded that the prisoners would eventually escape and alert the imperials or the bounty hunters of their presense at Tatooine, or worse, steal their ship.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Zulgyan wrote:
Episode V: EXPLORING THE WASTES

After executing the prisoners they kept back at the ship, the party leaves for the desert guided by Arno, on the old man's skiff.


They kill the prisoners in cold blood? Even the Force users?


The Force User didn't take part in the decision. It was Kyle (a Rebel) and Kal Urbo (a Mercenary) who deemed that is was too risky to leave the ship alone with the prisoners while they left for the desert. They concluded that the prisoners would eventually escape and alert the imperials or the bounty hunters of their presense at Tatooine, or worse, steal their ship.


Convenient for the Force User.

Was the deed done behind his back, or did he have a chance to keep the slaughter from happening?



The First Edition Rules focus Dark Side Points on Force Users, and, in order to get a Dark Side Point, the character has to use the Force in an evil way.

Technically, by the First Edition Rules, characters who do evil, but don't use the Force to do it, do not get a Dark Side Point.

Although technically correct, I'm not sure that's the intention of the rule. And, you've got to consider characters like Cassian Andor, who shot an informant in the back in order not to get caught by Stormtroopers.



This is a sticky situation, and you have to decide how lenient you will be with Dark Side Points.

What I would do in this situation is award the entire group a single Dark Side Point. You can't turn down the path of the Dark Side with just a single point--you need two points minimum for that.

I'd give even the non-Force users the 1 DSP.

But, I wouldn't give the non-Force users any more DSPs for things like this--not unless what they do is over the top, purely evil, with no justification at all. In other words, if they wipe out a Tusken Raider village, women and children, then put the children on a spit, cook 'em, and eat them, then I'd give them a second DSP.

The single DSP is to indicate Kharma--that the character is heading down the wrong road. But, the character needs to be a Serial Killer in order to get more than one DSP.

For the Force Users, I am less restrictive with the DSPs, but I will watch to see if the Force is used to do evil. So, if a Force Users uses Telekinesis to flat a dagger over to slice the throat of a rival for a woman the Force users likes, then that's definitely a DSP offense. But, if Force User uses a blaster to execute more prisoners, then I might not give him another DSP beyond the one he's already got.

It's very subjective, yes.

Remember, in D6 terms, Luke gets a DSP after fighting Vader at Cloud City. It's the anger her gets in fighting his father. But, he doesn't get another DSP in the original trilogy.

Likewise, Saw Gerrera is a terrorist freedom fighter who's probably done a lot of questionable things. We see him use the Bor Gullet on his prisoners, even though the thing could zap the person's mind permanently. You can count on civilians being killed because of Gerrera's operations in the past.

But neither of these characters fall to the Dark Side. I bet both have 1 DSP (Gerrera probably has one).

Again, this is very subjective. You have to decide how you want to play DSPs in your game.

Note that ERIC TRAUTMANN's write-up of the characters in Rogue One, he gives Cassian Andor 2 DSP's. And, he gives Baze Malbus 1 DSP.

That goes right along with what I'm saying. Neither are Force Users.

And, Cassian--you can tell--is a haunted man. He hurts, inside, from the things he's done in the name of Rebellion. It eats at his soul.

I think 2 DSPs is appropriate for him. He had a chance to go to the Dark Side, but didn't roll that "1" needed. Maybe next time. His heart is heavy.

When Cassian defies orders and goes with Jyn on a noble cause to get the Death Star plans, that quest serves as Cassian's attonement. The man has to go. If not, he knows that he's lost.





Put some thought into how you want to be with DSP's. My advice is to give all the characters a single DSP, then back off, watch what they do. It might have seemed like the right thing to execute those men, but could they have just tied them up somewhere? Or locked them inside someplace? Knocked them out for a bit and left?

Do you see Han Solo, who definitely skirts the law, killing prisoners like that? I don't. He'd find another way.



EDIT: BTW, the Rules Companion does alter the DSP rule a bit in saying that, sometimes, DSPs can be awarded for actions that don't involve the Force, which supports what I've said here.

And, if you don't want to give a DSP for the above, you may want to tell the players how their conscious is screwing with them the way it does when we do something that we wished we hadn't. It's regret setting in.

When you say that, and the player says, "No, not my character. My character slept like a baby and has no issues at all killing those men. They would have done the same to us." This is the character who is farther down the path of the Dark Side than the others. Watch him closely and be a little quicker to award another DSP to this character than you are the others who are genuinely mournful for killing those men.


Last edited by Wajeb Deb Kaadeb on Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EPISODE VI: BATTLE IN THE DESERT

Encounter One: Lank's Farm
Nothing out of the ordinary happened here. They rescued the girl and Arno took her back to the Dim-Ur, just as laid out in the module. The party continued it's journey without Arno.

Encounter Two: Defeated Bounty Hunters
Played out just as described in the module.

Encounter Three: Tusken Raiders
Now here things got really interesting. The party was piloting the skiff through the canyon. Slowly I built up the momentum (tremors, dust in the distance, etc.) and finally told them that the Bantha Stampede was coming at great speed towards them.

I started asking: "What do you do? Quickly. What do you do?". They started debating among themselves, but no one took a decision. They asked me questions about what would happen if they jumped from the skiff, or tried to maneuver it away from the stampede. I provided some clues, but nothing too conclusive (you still want to keep some level of uncertainty). They stayed in a state of paralysis. No one was doing nothing concrete. I started counting from 5 to 1. Nobody did nothing, paralyzed by decision...

I thought to myself that this could be a good opportunity to teach a basic RPG lesson: "you must decide your actions quickly or s*** happens". But maybe the lesson was far too harsh. At the last second, Kyle said "I jump over a Bantha". And the rest did nothing. The skiff was totally overruned by the stampede, together with the party. I ruled that Kyle needed two more easy (10) jump checks to get safely to the other side of the stamped. Unfortunately, he failed his last check by 1, and fell into the last part of the stampede.

Result: the skiff was totally destroyed, the R2 droid was totally destroyed. All characters were wounded, two of them incapacitated, one mortally wounded. The Wookie used all of the party's medpacks in order to recover the party as much as possible. But it was not enough. 2 out of 6 where wounded. And they still had the Tusken Fort fight against Jodo Kast next, with a partially wounded party and no medpacks left. The situation was quite dire. Lessons learned the (maybe too) hard way...

They continued their travels by foot and meet the Sandpeople Ambush. They managed to trade like 10 blaster rifles (looted from dead bounty hunters from past fights) to get a free pass. This was a great relief for me as the GM, because a fight against 20 enemies would had been a dice rolling nightmare (one of the weaknesses of the d6 system IMO).

NEXT, EPISODE VII: SLAUGHTER AT TUSKEN FORT!


Last edited by Zulgyan on Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:26 pm; edited 4 times in total
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Zulgyan wrote:
Episode V: EXPLORING THE WASTES

After executing the prisoners they kept back at the ship, the party leaves for the desert guided by Arno, on the old man's skiff.


They kill the prisoners in cold blood? Even the Force users?


Ok. A player is making me remember what actually happed.

The prisoners were set free, but Kal Urbo (the Mercenary) killed them from behind as they ran away. An individual decision of his. Anyway, your explanation is still very useful for future scenarios. As prisoner situations show up again and again in RPGs. Thanks for the super detailed answer!!
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Side note: Maxias the Failed Jedi learned from Old Arno that maybe a clue to repairing his damaged lightsaber could be found at old Ben Kenobi's house. Through out the adventure Maxias was looking for the opportunity to break from the group and get to Obi Wan's house. But he choose to keep faithful to mission of rescuing Tallon first and did not split from the group.
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:

Note that ERIC TRAUTMANN's write-up of the characters in Rogue One, he gives Cassian Andor 2 DSP's. And, he gives Baze Malbus 1 DSP.

That goes right along with what I'm saying. Neither are Force Users.

And, Cassian--you can tell--is a haunted man. He hurts, inside, from the things he's done in the name of Rebellion. It eats at his soul.

I think 2 DSPs is appropriate for him. He had a chance to go to the Dark Side, but didn't roll that "1" needed. Maybe next time. His heart is heavy.

When Cassian defies orders and goes with Jyn on a noble cause to get the Death Star plans, that quest serves as Cassian's attonement. The man has to go. If not, he knows that he's lost.


This information is awesome! Thanks for pointing it out!
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:

Note that ERIC TRAUTMANN's write-up of the characters in Rogue One, he gives Cassian Andor 2 DSP's. And, he gives Baze Malbus 1 DSP.

That goes right along with what I'm saying. Neither are Force Users.

And, Cassian--you can tell--is a haunted man. He hurts, inside, from the things he's done in the name of Rebellion. It eats at his soul.

I think 2 DSPs is appropriate for him. He had a chance to go to the Dark Side, but didn't roll that "1" needed. Maybe next time. His heart is heavy.

When Cassian defies orders and goes with Jyn on a noble cause to get the Death Star plans, that quest serves as Cassian's attonement. The man has to go. If not, he knows that he's lost.


This information is awesome! Thanks for pointing it out!




I like the 1 DSP, too. It serves as a warning. If you see an NPC with 1 DSP, then it tells you that he's a character willing to do whatever it takes to get the job done. He's a Jack Bauer type (from the 24 television series) who will fire his pistol into a prisoner's kneecap, maiming him for life, in order to get what he needs from the man.

1 DSP on a good, allied character means that the man has been taken to the edge somewhere in his life. Luke wanted to kill his own father when he faced Darth Vader at Cloud City. The man had taken his hand! Cassian shoots an informant in the back because he's too slow and crippled enough so that it's not likely that the guy won't evade the stormtroopers.

People with 1 DSP can fight for the side of right, but they are a little too extreme in their actions.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
The prisoners were set free, but Kal Urbo (the Mercenary) killed them from behind as they ran away. An individual decision of his. Anyway, your explanation is still very useful for future scenarios. As prisoner situations show up again and again in RPGs. Thanks for the super detailed answer!!


Do the other players admonish Kal Urbo for his actions?

This is where good roleplaying comes in. Would you work with a man such as this? A cold blooded murderer?

I'd definitely give Kal Urbo a DSP...well, maybe a Warning is more appropriate at this stage of the game since you didn't give it when it happened.

For the rest, they should at least get a warning, even if they couldn't prevent it, especially if the just watched it happen and had no feeling or emotion towards it.





Actually, given the situation, I think what I would do now is not say anything at all about it to the players. But, I'd consider it and watch for more conduct worthy of a warning--then give them a warning before they act in the next situation.

You're all learning to play the game, after all.
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Later in the adventure (the final Starship Battle) Kal Urbo actually performed a heroic deed using a Force Point, saving the party from a TPK. So I finally ruled that he won't gain the extra Force Point that would take him to 2 Force Points. Just 1 Force Point for the next adventure. Sort of a middle ground and warning for his dubious actions. His murder of the prisoners had some reason to it, that of the prisoners not warning Jodo Kast about their presence at Tatooine (though Jodo Kast already knew quite clearly).

Last edited by Zulgyan on Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Side note: Maxias the Failed Jedi learned from Old Arno that maybe a clue to repairing his damaged lightsaber could be found at old Ben Kenobi's house. Through out the adventure Maxias was looking for the opportunity to break from the group and get to Obi Wan's house. But he choose to keep faithful to mission of rescuing Tallon first and did not split from the group.


You have an opportunity here to set up a situation where the player playing Maxias gets a decision to make--at a dramatically important moment.

You could set up an opportunity to get the lightsaber, or maybe a key to a special lock in Kenobi's workroom--something that the player highly desires for the character. But, in following that route, he ends up not being there for the other party members when they desperately need him.

Tease the character with the bait--whatever it is (you'll have to figure out something that will catch the interest of the player). Do this secretly--maybe writing notes to the player or taking him aside privately, so that he knows that he has a real opportunity.

And, right when the player is good and hooked, you have a fight break out with the party. Maxias can use the fight as cover to sneak off in the commotion. Or, he can sacrifice what he wants to stay with the group.

The key is sacrifice. If the player will be greedy for his character, or if he will be true to his friends.

Maybe you can come up with something a lot better than I'm thinking of right off the top of my head.

But, once you get the player real interested, you present him with a decision. If he wants the saber, he's got to go now.

Or, he can stay and help his out-gunned friends.

If he goes, he does get the saber.

If he doesn't go, he doesn't get the saber (now...let him feel the loss. You can always have him get another chance at getting a saber down the road a bit).

But, what he does earn by staying with his friends is good will in the Force.

That act increases a Force power by a pip! Or, maybe he learns a new Force power. Or, reward him with a Force Point.

But, make sure that he sacrifices to get what you give him.

Player eat this stuff up, when its done right. And, it's right in line with the true meaning of the Force in the game.
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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You have an opportunity here to set up a situation where the player playing Maxias gets a decision to make--at a dramatically important moment.


I have already played this out, as you will learn in my future posts. Cool suggestions.


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Zulgyan
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Do the other players admonish Kal Urbo for his actions?


There was some mild complaining, but not that much really. Kal Urbo is on the rebellion's payroll to beef up the party's firepower for the mission. They don't like him but they need him.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zulgyan wrote:
Later in the adventure (the final Starship Battle) Kal Urbo actually performed a heroic deed using a Force Point, saving the party from a TPK. So I finally ruled that he won't gain the extra Force Point that would take him to 2 Force Points. Just 1 Force Point for the next adventure. Sort of a middle ground and warning for his dubious actions. His murder of the prisoners had some reason for it, of the prisoners not warning Jodo Kast about their arrival at Tatooine (though Jodo Kast already knew this clearly).


Believe it or not, I think that's a bit harsh!

I'd give him the 2 FPs and just do what I said above--I'd watch and warn him the next time he gets close to getting a DSP.

I also like taking this stuff out of the realm of just mechanics and turning it more into a roleplaying moment.

For example, I'd give him the 2 FPs. He's getting stronger in the Force, even if he is not Force sensitive.

Then, at the next downtime moment, instead of skipping over it, I'd tell the player (maybe secretly--players love stuff when they are singled out and the others don't know what's going on) that he's starting to have bad dreams. He keeps seeing those men die. Shot in the back. He's starting to wonder if they have families. Children? Is there a wife out there wondering when her man will return? Her husband just disappears with no word? Horrible dreams. Try to use your description to actually make the player feel bad in real life.

For your own justification, which I would not share with the player, the character is stronger in the Force, and that is flowing threw him--even when he sleeps, giving him the bad dreams--the Light Side fighting the Dark Side within him.

THAT'S the cool way to give the warning.

Your player will probably respond to something like this a lot more than he would if you just tell him, "If you do something like that again, I'm going to give you a DSP."
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