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Growf, Wookie Gladiator
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheshire wrote:
I think for the reason mentioned above, if one of my players wanted to play this character, I would dissuade them from doing so. This might be fun for one person, but if it too badly disrupts the game balance, it can detract from other players' fun.


Growf is definitely powerful enough that he would need a player with a steady hand... he takes advantage of some loopholes in the rules to be an incredibly tough character. Heck, the nature of specializations means he'll find it relatively easy to grow, and the vagueness of the brawling/martial arts rules means there's no real way to separate him from his specialization. His main weakness is anything outside of being big and scary... he's got not Mechanical, not Technical, he's not fast. In a group that can compensate for that, he can be golden, but encounters that start at range can heavily disadvantage him.
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Bren
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrNexx wrote:
Oh, there's a ton of ways to kill Growf. But I'm just saying that the Man in Black would have a bit of trouble against this particular Fezzik.
This man in Black wouldn't have any trouble.

And with Dodge 2D+1 he is really easy to hit with a blaster. Use combined actions and add the optional rules for trading off attack chance (or rolling over the target number) for extra damage and he's toast.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrNexx wrote:
Heck, the nature of specializations means he'll find it relatively easy to grow, and the vagueness of the brawling/martial arts rules means there's no real way to separate him from his specialization.


That's one of the biggest reasons i dislike martial arts in any form, being a specialization of brawl.. There's just NO way to realistically separate them out..
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bren wrote:
MrNexx wrote:
Oh, there's a ton of ways to kill Growf. But I'm just saying that the Man in Black would have a bit of trouble against this particular Fezzik.
This man in Black wouldn't have any trouble.


Now I am wanting to make a filk...

garhkal wrote:
That's one of the biggest reasons i dislike martial arts in any form, being a specialization of brawl.. There's just NO way to realistically separate them out..


I agree completely. With Melee Combat, there's a possibility you won't have your favored Vibroblade with which you specialized, and have to fall back on a chair leg. But with Brawling specializations, it's pretty much GM fiat if you can't use it... and then you wind up with people choosing styles that it's hard to take away. Oh, Bob's arms are pinned, so he can't use his boxing specialization? Too bad for Bob. I studied Jeet Kun Do, so I have like six different forms I can take that will let me headbutt this guy to death.
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“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/
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Telsij
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bren wrote:
This man in Black wouldn't have any trouble.

Oh man, as many times as I've seen the movie, I do enjoy it when stills like this reveal details I'd either not noticed or hadn't paid too much attention to before — like the rebel trooper prisoner with his heads on his head at the far right, as that is either cut off on-screen or only in frame briefly.

Mr.Nexx wrote:
Now I am wanting to make a filk...

Please do! In one of the bands I was in back in college, one of the songs our bassist composed had as its bridge / breakdown, a tuneful but spoken word non-sequitor fantasy filk verse.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrNexx wrote:

I agree completely. With Melee Combat, there's a possibility you won't have your favored Vibroblade with which you specialized, and have to fall back on a chair leg. But with Brawling specializations, it's pretty much GM fiat if you can't use it... and then you wind up with people choosing styles that it's hard to take away. Oh, Bob's arms are pinned, so he can't use his boxing specialization? Too bad for Bob. I studied Jeet Kun Do, so I have like six different forms I can take that will let me headbutt this guy to death.


Maybe that's why MORE DM's should practice using the word "NO!!"..
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
MrNexx wrote:

I agree completely. With Melee Combat, there's a possibility you won't have your favored Vibroblade with which you specialized, and have to fall back on a chair leg. But with Brawling specializations, it's pretty much GM fiat if you can't use it... and then you wind up with people choosing styles that it's hard to take away. Oh, Bob's arms are pinned, so he can't use his boxing specialization? Too bad for Bob. I studied Jeet Kun Do, so I have like six different forms I can take that will let me headbutt this guy to death.


Maybe that's why MORE DM's should practice using the word "NO!!"..


Perhaps, but it simply goes back to bad design... there's no reason to GENERALIZE in Brawling. Heck, treating brawling like lightsaber, and making specialization in attack or defense gives more reason.
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“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True.. IMO WEG did a major disservice when they did the RoE book which iirc first introduced martial arts as a specialization..
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Bren
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martial Arts are an option. Ignore them if you find them unsatisfying.

If one allows one of the optional rules to increase damage you don't need a martial arts skill to do more damage since extra damage is already possible by having a good brawling attack. And avoiding damage is already possible with a good brawling parry.


The two options I recall are

(a) Before rolling to hit, the attacker can trading off attack dice for extra damage assuming the attack hits. A 2 attack dice for 1 damage dice trade off works for me.

(b) After rolling to hit, increase the damage if the attack exceeds the target number. Typical ratios I've seen are 1/3 or 1/5. I like 1/5 as the math is a bit easier and I don't really want to increase damage too much.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which brings me back to the where DM's need to say the word "NO" more..
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