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Hyperspace Change of Course
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:13 pm    Post subject: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

Now, we know that it is possible to change a ship's destination after entering hyperspace.

Should the normal rules be used to do this. Calculating coordinates is no different from doing it in normal space?

Or, should it be more difficult? Maybe the base difficulty is 20 or 25 instead of 15?

Thoughts?
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Whill
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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Now, we know that it is possible to change a ship's destination after entering hyperspace.

Should the normal rules be used to do this. Calculating coordinates is no different from doing it in normal space?

Or, should it be more difficult? Maybe the base difficulty is 20 or 25 instead of 15?

Thoughts?

I feel like we've had a thread for this in recent months.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I must have missed that one.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 11:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Now, we know that it is possible to change a ship's destination after entering hyperspace.

Should the normal rules be used to do this. Calculating coordinates is no different from doing it in normal space?

Or, should it be more difficult? Maybe the base difficulty is 20 or 25 instead of 15?

Thoughts?


No matter what films show, i still feel one needs to go in a 'relatively straight' line in hyperspace, so if one needs to change destination one must drop out and recalculate..
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 12:34 am    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Now, we know that it is possible to change a ship's destination after entering hyperspace... Thoughts?

No matter what films show, i still feel one needs to go in a 'relatively straight' line in hyperspace, so if one needs to change destination one must drop out and recalculate..

But nothing in space actually moves in a straight line due to gravity. Planets orbit stars and stars orbit the center of the galaxy in curved paths. Even light bends due to gravity, which is how we can see stars directly behind other stars from our point of view. We know that gravity from realspace effects hyperspace. So a ship's path through hyperspace already curves as the course was plotted. If you want to have ships drop out of hyperspace to recalculate a new course that's one thing, but they wouldn't have been traveling in straight line in the first place.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hence my statement of 'relatively straight'
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
No matter what films show, i still feel one needs to go in a 'relatively straight' line in hyperspace, so if one needs to change destination one must drop out and recalculate..


All the maps, even with the EU, long before the new movies, show hyperspace routes that are curvy, like freeways, not straight shots.

I'm reading the first X-Wing book right now, and in it, making hyperspace route adjustments is an exercise in avoiding obstacles--again, not really a straight line.
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Naaman
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get where garhkal is coming from. The footage of hyperspace travel shows changes of direction through the view port of the millenium falcon.


Nevertheless, the arc of the curve must necessarily be very gentle relative to the total distance traveled ina given amount of time. Freeways were mentioned above, which provides an excellent support for garhkal's assertion. You don't see immediate 90 -degree turns on a freeway like you do at a street intersection. It would defeat the purpose of a freeway, since cars must slow down to male the turn. Only curves that can be negotiated at freeway speeds are allowed inthe freeway construction, with slight reductions allowed on occasion.

Having said that, I don't see a problem with changing destinations if the new destination requires a minimal change in heading. If the new destination is back the other way or 90-degrees from the current vector, then rerouting would either require an unorthodox route to be calculated so as not to have to drop out of hyperspace while having turns gentle enough that the ship can male them safely (which may significantly extend the length of the trip and cost significantly more fuel/resources), or else drop out of hyper space, change heading and plot the most efficient route.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

g, the problem with your theory is that the star maps shown in the WEG books show few, if any, straight lines.

I find it far more likely that a hyperspace course is made up of an immensely long string of numbers, representing heading and duration, course changes, and so on and so forth. The numbers have to be extremely precise, both because of the speeds and distances involved and because of the potential consequences of a miscalculation.

Altering course in hyperspace requires making a major change in that string of numbers in mid-stream, which invites disaster if not executed properly. As such, most crews will drop into realspace to recalculate.

It's also likely that the course is loaded into a heavily shielded, tamper-proof data processor to protect the course from data corruption, or EMP or radiation effects. And tamper-proof includes the ship's own crew.

The only way around it would be a special add-on system like the N-CRAB (see Galladinium's Fantastic Technology) that allows the ship's crew to essentially hack their own hyperdrive mid-flight.

Just because a course change occurred in hyperspace aboard an Intel courier platform on a high-priority mission answering directly to the head of Alliance Intel does not constitute conclusive proof that this is a common occurrence. A more believable scenario would be that N-CRAB system is available sooner, and in greater numbers than is assumed in the WEG material. That way, it can be assumed that a dedicated Intel courier could be equipped with one of a limited number of them to assist in rapid course changes, as well as a Hyper-Comm burst transceiver, so as to both send and receive orders from high command and react to them expeditiously.

Making such a system be the exception instead of the rule explains what we see in Rogue One without requiring a major change to hyperspace travel in general.
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RyanDarkstar
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've often wondered how ships don't crash into each other while in hyperspace or when entering/exiting hyperspace? Do sensors automatically detect other ships and course-correct while in hyperspace?
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RyanDarkstar wrote:
I've often wondered how ships don't crash into each other while in hyperspace or when entering/exiting hyperspace? Do sensors automatically detect other ships and course-correct while in hyperspace?


I read somewhere--I think it was the Sourcebook--that accidents do happen, but they are rare.

Ships jump to hyperspace and are never heard from again.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 1:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
garhkal wrote:
No matter what films show, i still feel one needs to go in a 'relatively straight' line in hyperspace, so if one needs to change destination one must drop out and recalculate..


All the maps, even with the EU, long before the new movies, show hyperspace routes that are curvy, like freeways, not straight shots.

I'm reading the first X-Wing book right now, and in it, making hyperspace route adjustments is an exercise in avoiding obstacles--again, not really a straight line.


You obviously didn't see my clarification post right above. Relatively straight means more or less in a straight line, but there can be some curves here and there.
Just like if you look at a free-way map, I70 going from Columbus to Indianapolis is 'relatively straight', but there's plenty of curves there. Or going from San diego to San fran up I5, is a "Straight shot" with curves all over.. BUT you are staying on the same freeway, not getting off, onto another freeway (analogus to changing course)..
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 1:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Hyperspace Change of Course Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
garhkal wrote:
No matter what films show, i still feel one needs to go in a 'relatively straight' line in hyperspace, so if one needs to change destination one must drop out and recalculate..


All the maps, even with the EU, long before the new movies, show hyperspace routes that are curvy, like freeways, not straight shots.

I'm reading the first X-Wing book right now, and in it, making hyperspace route adjustments is an exercise in avoiding obstacles--again, not really a straight line.


You obviously didn't see my clarification post right above.


I did see that. I was just giving you some references, that's all.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
RyanDarkstar wrote:
I've often wondered how ships don't crash into each other while in hyperspace or when entering/exiting hyperspace? Do sensors automatically detect other ships and course-correct while in hyperspace?


I read somewhere--I think it was the Sourcebook--that accidents do happen, but they are rare.

Ships jump to hyperspace and are never heard from again.

It's also likely that we don't truly appreciate the distances involved. A "course" could easily be a lightyear or more across. Even if it is just a few light weeks or months in diameter, even the largest starships are going to be less than a dust mote in the volume in question. It's also possible - returning to the freeway analogy - that a given route could be broken down into "lanes," corridors within the route path itself depending on the direction and speed being traveled. After all, a freeway only works if everyone stays on their side, and the slow traffic stays out of the way of the fast traffic.
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Amazing. Everything you just said was wrong.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
It's also likely that we don't truly appreciate the distances involved.


Excellent point. I wish I could find one of those maps that gives us an idea of just how far it is to the planets in our own solar system. It's an eye-opener.
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