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Falconer
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Joined: 08 Dec 2014
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 Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:59 pm Post subject: Thrawn Trilogy + The Force Awakens |
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| Taking purely The Thrawn Trilogy novels and The Force Awakens movie, and ignoring all of the other non-canon and canon sources related to each (ignoring even TFA novelization, etc.), is there any reason they can’t more or less coexist in the same universe, i.e., in my imagination or in my campaign? Are there any major ways in which the two contradict each other? The only one that jumps out at me is Leia having twins in TTT vs. apparently just one child in TFA (although we don’t know that for sure). |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 12:43 am Post subject: Re: Thrawn Trilogy + The Force Awakens |
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| Falconer wrote: | | Taking purely The Thrawn Trilogy novels and The Force Awakens movie, and ignoring all of the other non-canon and canon sources related to each (ignoring even TFA novelization, etc.), is there any reason they can’t more or less coexist in the same universe, i.e., in my imagination or in my campaign? Are there any major ways in which the two contradict each other? The only one that jumps out at me is Leia having twins in TTT vs. apparently just one child in TFA (although we don’t know that for sure). |
Except for the end of TLC, I really liked The Thrawn Trilogy. And I am not particularly enamored to any of Disney's post-RotJ non-filmic continuity, so I like the idea behind this thread!
As you mentioned, the Solo children is the first thing that stands out to me too. No, we don't know for sure from TFA that Han and Leia only had the one child, Ben Solo (although it's implied), but we do know for sure from TTT that Han and Leia didn't have a child before the J-twins. Leia's pregnancy significantly factors into the story so I wouldn't remove that when reconciling these two stories. If you are ok with TFA taking place father in the future of RotJ than on the official timeline, then you could replace J & J with Ben Solo and still preserve Kylo Ren's 30-ish age in TFA. You could even move TTT to take place a couple years earlier if you wanted to.
Of course in your imagination and campaign, you could do whatever you want.
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Cap'nCodskale
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Joined: 23 Oct 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Portland OR
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| Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:48 pm Post subject: A fan, I am not |
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| I did recently hear rumor that Thrawn may appear during the third season of SW:Rebels. If true, it aligns with my current assessment of Lucasfilm story group's approach to EU content. That is, many persons, places, and things introduced in EU continue to exist, but without story baggage. |
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Falconer
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Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 315
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| Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:56 pm Post subject: |
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Almost like the Marvel Cinematic Universe—it’s a different continuity from the comics, but they freely mine the comics for characters and ideas and storylines.
In which case, like comic snobs who continue to understand comic continuity to be the “real” one, anyone so inclined might be snobbishly favorable towards their own favorite corner of the EU (eg., WEG/Bantam era 8)).
Anyway, I think that Thrawn rumor is unsubstantiated, but it’s surely only a matter of time before he shows up. Heck, I know lots of people who are hoping Mara Jade makes it into the new movies. You never know.
Anyway, yeah, no new thoughts on the OP, really. I just stand in awe of Zahn’s novels, because it was basically a shot at rebooting the franchise, and he did it brilliantly. Good storytelling, good Star Warsey adventure, good setup for the universe. Other than minor discrepancies surrounding Luke/Han/Leia and their marital and parental status, the TTT universe can quite logically lead into the TFA universe, as far as I can tell. The New Republic is taken for granted in TFA, so, there you go.
Here’s another thought I had with regard to the structure of the series. What if it were a simple binary structure, with A being “rebels blow up the death star” and B being “the empire strikes back”?
A - Star Wars
B - The Empire Strikes Back
A - Return of the Jedi
B - ??
A - The Force Awakens
So to make this work I would like to imagine a strong “B” story to bridge Jedi and TFA. Something like the Thrawn Campaign or the Emperor Reborn Crisis but without resolving itself, instead dovetailing into TFA. Might be a good premise for a campaign if the players could be sold on the idea of a lost episode. |
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Teazia
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Joined: 10 Sep 2014
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 2:02 am Post subject: |
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I know alot of folks had the saying of In JJ We Trust last year, but I now feel that was misguided. For the true believers, it should be In Filoni We Trust. For a person in power, he is the closest we now have to the GOUT (George's Original Unedited Trilogy).
As he actively tries to fold in EU/OS SW stuff back into the mix, I feel Thrawn is likely and it maybe it will happen sooner than we think (There will be a few episodes of Rebels S3 at Celebration next month). |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Teazia wrote: | | I know alot of folks had the saying of In JJ We Trust last year, but I now feel that was misguided. For the true believers, it should be In Filoni We Trust. For a person in power, he is the closest we now have to the GOUT (George's Original Unedited Trilogy). |
"True believers" huh? "Should"? There's enough room in Star Wars fandom for everyone.
I don't really disagree with your statement that Filoni is the closest thing to George Lucas currently in power at Disneyfilm, but Filoni is still far removed from the Original Unedited Trilogy. In between you've got the altered trilogy and the prequels. And George Lucas' 2005 statements about his completed 6-film saga as a whole, like Anakin not being promoted to Jedi Knight until 6 months before RotS, and Anakin never having a padawan. That made sense with respect to the (then final) product we got. Filoni didn't come until 2 years later when Lucas was suddenly contradicting his view of the 6-film saga at its completion in ways to keep the franchise more marketable for a potential sale. Lucas got Filoni on board with ridiculous retcons to live action Star Wars, like Anakin now being promoted to Knight in literally weeks after Yoda sensed from across the galaxy that Anakin was in terrible pain (from his mother traumatically dying in his arms before massacring an entire village in rage), and literally days after his promotion the Jedi Council thinking it would be wise to give this deeply troubled and dangerous Jedi his own padawan to teach him a lesson about attachment. The 2007-2012 Lucas that Filoni is close to is vastly different from even the 2005 Lucas, let alone the Original Unedited Trilogy Lucas from the 80s.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Falconer wrote: | | Other than minor discrepancies surrounding Luke/Han/Leia and their marital and parental status, the TTT universe can quite logically lead into the TFA universe, as far as I can tell. The New Republic is taken for granted in TFA, so, there you go. |
I'm not sure what you mean. What "minor discrepancies surrounding Luke/Han/Leia and their marital and parental status"? Han and Leia are married in TTT. They are still married but separated in TFA. J&J's birth is part of the story of TTT, but those kids specifically or even the fact that they are twins don't factor into the story in any significant way I can recall. Luke wasn't married in TTT and he had no kids. Rey was born 11 years after RotJ, so even if Luke had been married and was Rey's father, there doesn't seem to be any discrepancies (yet anyway).
| Falconer wrote: | Here's another thought I had with regard to the structure of the series. What if it were a simple binary structure, with A being "rebels blow up the death star" and B being "the empire strikes back"?
A - Star Wars
B - The Empire Strikes Back
A - Return of the Jedi
B - ??
A - The Force Awakens
So to make this work I would like to imagine a strong "B" story to bridge Jedi and TFA. Something like the Thrawn Campaign or the Emperor Reborn Crisis but without resolving itself, instead dovetailing into TFA. Might be a good premise for a campaign if the players could be sold on the idea of a lost episode. |
Sounds cool.
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Teazia
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Joined: 10 Sep 2014
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 3:05 am Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | | Teazia wrote: | | I know alot of folks had the saying of In JJ We Trust last year, but I now feel that was misguided. For the true believers, it should be In Filoni We Trust. For a person in power, he is the closest we now have to the GOUT (George's Original Unedited Trilogy). |
"True believers" huh? "Should"? There's enough room in Star Wars fandom for everyone.
I don't really disagree with your statement that Filoni is the closest thing to George Lucas currently in power at Disneyfilm, but Filoni is still far removed from the Original Unedited Trilogy. In between you've got the altered trilogy and the prequels. And George Lucas' 2005 statements about his completed 6-film saga as a whole, like Anakin not being promoted to Jedi Knight until 6 months before RotS, and Anakin never having a padawan. That made sense with respect to the (then final) product we got. Filoni didn't come until 2 years later when Lucas was suddenly contradicting his view of the 6-film saga at its completion in ways to keep the franchise more marketable for a potential sale. Lucas got Filoni on board with ridiculous retcons to live action Star Wars, like Anakin now being promoted to Knight in literally weeks after Yoda sensed from across the galaxy that Anakin was in terrible pain (from his mother traumatically dying in his arms before massacring an entire village in rage), and literally days after his promotion the Jedi Council thinking it would be wise to give this deeply troubled and dangerous Jedi his own padawan to teach him a lesson about attachment. The 2007-2012 Lucas that Filoni is close to is vastly different from even the 2005 Lucas, let alone the Original Unedited Trilogy Lucas from the 80s. |
Yes, there is room for everyone. BTW, do you have Harmy's De-specialized Editions? |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Teazia wrote: | | Yes, there is room for everyone. BTW, do you have Harmy's De-specialized Editions? |
No, and I don't need them. I'm an oddball OG (original generation) Star Wars fan who first saw SW in the theater 1977 and watched the unaltered versions of all three CT films about 100 times each from 87-96 yet likes the altered versions and prequels (and TFA). The only Lucas change I flat-out don't accept is Greedo shooting (but it's not 'childhood raping' for me like it is for so many). I don't hate Jedi Rocks but I do like Lapti Nek better. There are a handful of changes that are completely inconsequential which I label as "Whatever George" (For example, I don't care how many rocks are in front of R2's hiding place, or what Obi-Wan's fake kraat dragon call sounds like). The rest of the changes are improvements and I like them. In fact, I'm actually the Anti-Purist, because I have a laundry list of changes that Lucas should have made but didn't.
I admit I simply do not have the ability to comprehend the very popular need in SW fandom to have the original unaltered films in the highest definition quality possible but have no Lucas changes. If the original versions of the films are so precious, then just watch the original versions, which were released on DVD if you don't still have VHS tech hooked up (my blu-ray player is sitting on top of my fully functional VCR). I would think the imperfections and lower definition would be part of the charm. See, I do get nostalgia. I have a nice record player and a decent record collection. I like to listen to records occasionally but I don't do it for sound quality. The snap, crackle and pop are part of the charm, the nostalgic experience of an old era I grew up in. I would think that if you venerate the original unaltered trilogy, the lesser quality would make it a more 'authentic'. But no, fans must to have their cake and eat it too.
I have still never watched my copies of the unaltered TESB or RotJ on DVD, so haven't seen those versions of the films since 1996. I did watch my original unaltered SW DVD once. It's still great. When I tell people my favorite overall movie of all time is the original Star Wars, some of them ask, "Which version?" My answer is, "Any of them". I'm sure I would like the de-specialized version too. The movie is so awesome that even Greedo firing couldn't possibly ruin the whole movie for me. It seems to me that if Greedo firing ruins the film for you, you must not have a very high opinion of the film. If Greedo firing somehow reaches backwards through time and alters your childhood, then you must be caught in some Star Trek space-time anomaly and need to get that checked out!
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Teazia
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| There are now some other HD versions floating around, but Harmy's is more accessible atm. I highly recommend you find his ANH, it is a revelation. |
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