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Making a ship a home
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Urban Spaceman
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:10 am    Post subject: Making a ship a home Reply with quote

Hello all.
Just after some advice/opinions. We're at a point in my campaign where the PC's have a lot of cash and some time, so are considering modifying their ship.
However, there are some changes beyond the usual more/bigger guns, faster engines and better shields (which I have the prices for).
They want to convert part of their ship to a basic medical bay, and another part of the ship in to a brig.


I can cost up the parts easy enough, but this figure that there's rewiring, power levels and all sorts of other work involved that make it not too dissimilar to converting/remodelling a room in the real world.

So, does anyone have any ideas for how long and how expensive this kind of work should/could be? I'm not a home owner, so can't even base things on the real world versions.

They have a YT-1300, if that makes a difference to people's thoughts.

Thanks for any input/experience people can bring to this.
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Zarn
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You probably want several things.

In order to mock up a new look for their YT-1300, you could look to this: http://rpggamer.org/main.php?page=cec-designer%2Fcec-designer.php

You probably want to consider a new deckplan as well.

There's also Galaxy Guide 6: Tramp Freighters, which contains some info about what you can do with a ship.

Personally, I wouldn't overcomplicate it. I'd have them buy a medical droid or two, perhaps a bacta tank, and let them have a patient capacity of 1 per stateroom dedicated to the medbay, and one extra for having the room for a medbay.

Similarly, I'd assume that 1 stateroom equals one person brig-space, and assume that whatever room there might be in difference would be dedicated to hardening the brig against escape (welding in plates so that a prisoner can't get to ducts and conduits, changing doors, and so on).

If I recall correctly, one can also convert cargo space to staterooms, at a cost of 10 metric tons per stateroom.

An YT-1300 is perhaps a bit small - I've been a fan of the YT-2400 and the YT-1930 for a long time because of their larger cargo capacities while still keeping that CEC design language.

Breaking this down, I suggest buying an FX, an MD and maybe a bacta tank for the med bay, converting 30 metric tons to staterooms to get a medbay with a capacity of two patients at a time (and arguably room for one in a bacta tank), and converting two staterooms to brig spaces (let's say a STR 9D door and walls). You'll end up with a passenger capacity of 4 and 70 metric tons of cargo, plus a medbay (capacity 2+1) and a brig (capacity 2).

However, removing more cargo space could mean customs might get suspicious... "If this is a legitimate freighter, why do you have hardly any room for cargo?!"
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luxury accommodations are a hard thing to model in terms of game stats, as there isn’t really a solid rule to reflect it

One possible option is if one were using Dredwulf60’s Stress And Relief rules, with more comfortable living spaces contributing to stress relief during down time.

Other options I played with here include decreasing CP costs for training in a luxury environment, bonuses to Persuasion rolls, and increasing the amount characters can charge passengers.
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Dredwulf60
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Luxury accommodations are a hard thing to model in terms of game stats, as there isn’t really a solid rule to reflect it

One possible option is if one were using Dredwulf60’s Stress And Relief rules, with more comfortable living spaces contributing to stress relief during down time.

Other options I played with here include decreasing CP costs for training in a luxury environment, bonuses to Persuasion rolls, and increasing the amount characters can charge passengers.


When using that stress system, I gave stress points for long space voyages.
A ship with a good aesthetics rating could reduce the amount of stress.

Aesthetics was rated between 2 and 12 and represented just how clean, polished, decorated, and nice to live in it was.


The Millennium Falcon under Lando's ownership would be about a 10.
The Millennium Falcon by the time of ANH would be about a 4.


You could do an overhaul to the ship's aesthetics, which costed an amount based on a percentage of the base price of the ship.

I placed base aesthetics at 2% of the base value of a ship.

ie. 100,000cr for a new ship, 2000cr of that goes toward the base aesthetics of the ship, giving it a rating of 6.

Bumping it up by a level costs the base value of the aesthetics...in this case 2000cr and is a space transports repair roll with a difficulty of 40 cumulative; multiple rolls are allowed to get to that difficulty number; each roll being 8 hours of work and increasing the cost by a factor.

ie. it takes 3 rolls to get to the 40 means the job took 24 hours and cost 3 times the base amount. In this case 2000cr x3 = 6000cr.

Under the wear system I developed, aesthetics can get reduced. Long-term use will be a part of it, but also catastrophic events. Like a blood-soaked duel or firefight on your ship....a break out of fire...having people come aboard who are covered in alien slime or mud...etc.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe a rewrite to tie it into the three luxury levels described in the Ships of the Galaxy supplement?
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Urban Spaceman
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All brilliant advice, just what I was looking for. Thank you all.
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Tupteq
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You may take a look at Hideouts & Strongholds - many of base modules can be easily adapted to a starship. With Galaxy Guide 6 and D6 conversion of Starships of the Galaxy your players should easily find all what they may want.

I agree with Zarn that YT-1300 may be a little too small. In such situation my players bought HT-2200 and they changed one cargo area to the gym (to train lightsaber combat and stuff like that), added bacta tank, armory, prison cells, starfighter hangar, machine shop, laboratory and luxury conversion. All costed them about 1M.
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Urban Spaceman
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are basically gutting out areas they have, and refitting them for a new purpose. When presented with all the options, they decided to only do one of the large scale changes (lounge area is a basic medbay now), which is most likely going to be the one they use.

There were other changes to weaponary and systems, an they paid for the work to be done for them, so I have plenty of options for Wild Die failures now!
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Mamatried
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to pop in late here, but this thread is actually very current to my SW group.

The concept of luxury and comfort came up with the concept of actually living in the ship.

Now the group has a fairly large ship, a GTHROC with 400tons capacity.

in our discussion we soert of disagrred what would contitute luxury, and what benfits it should give.

If we look at a Limmo, they can be very luxurious, but I would be more impressed with a van sorting the same luxury interior.

and what would a great looking wardrobe, gold taps on the bathroom and the like, a crystal mirror bar, soft leather seats and that.

I would maybe go as far as to allow some bonuses to certain cultutral, persuade, maybe even business roll.

There is however a huge differnce between you luxury cabin cruiser and the 1 billion donner yacht, the levels of luxury.

If we look at the interior of the "yacht" from TLJ, it was pretty luxurious, however the interior of the new falcon from solo wan't all that far behind and quite luxurius

so to me it is more what is luxury, does changing the boring grey panels with chrome really contitute anything other than cretist spent?

Would this not be included in any conversion from cargo to stateroom?

Would a bonus to training be fair for all luxury? what if a freelance TIE pilot did a "pimp my TIE" would this be luxury?

I would give training bonuses, as in reduced time, cost for training facilities, and good even superb does not always mean luxurieus.

so to me luxury is 99% cosmetic and gives nothing in the game other then the joy of the players to describe and bask in the "jooys of earning credits".
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Bren
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mamatried wrote:
I would maybe go as far as to allow some bonuses to certain cultutral, persuade, maybe even business roll.
Those make sense. I can also see having a luxury vessel as a prerequisite for characters who are pretending to be a member of the nobility or very wealth. And luxury will make even the true noble or truly wealthy person more credibly noble or wealthy. Not everyone has the personal presence of Princess Leia so having some actual trappings of wealth and power really help.

And I'd expect some PCs who have noble or wealthy backgrounds might get cranky unless they have regular access to the type of life they grew up with.

Quote:
so to me it is more what is luxury, does changing the boring grey panels with chrome really contitute anything other than cretist spent?
Decor matters, but I think there should also be some nice perks. Here's a few off the top of my head.
    Personally customizable, form fitting furniture with memory recall.
    Fancy showers in the freshers with extra sprayer nozzles, actual water instead of sonics, and dispensers with fancy scented, moisturizing soaps, shampoos, and conditioners instead of the generic standard freshers.
    Fancy toilets in the fresher - Star Wars versions of what is available in real-world Japane e.g. self-cleaning, music playing, low or no noise, heated seats, bidet wash and dry cycles, etc.
    Jacuzzi and/or hot tub with a skylight or moon roof.
    High end combination holo- and sound slug players in the lounge and staterooms.
    More space in the staterooms and beds instead of bunks.
    Staterooms with individually adjustable heat, humidity, gravity, light, etc.
    Room safes.
    Walk-in closet in the stateroom with a combination washer, dryer, clothes press to keep those fancy colored capes looking new and pressed.
    Instead of fancy colored or chrome panels have walls covered with giant, programmable holo screens showing outdoor scenery, city scapes, or dramatic views of novas, nebulas, and such.

It's also worth looking at the various tech supplements like Galladinium's Fantastic Technology, Cynabar's Fantastic Technology, and Gundark's Fantastic Technology to mine for fancy upgrades.

Quote:
so to me luxury is 99% cosmetic and gives nothing in the game other then the joy of the players to describe and bask in the "jooys of earning credits".
Yeah, pretty much this.
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Mamatried
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 20, 2019 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Other spending credits, is there really any actual mechanical effects from adding luxury.
as in if we add (I think meant as after market) staterooms these are 10 tons each, now are they 12 tons with luxury, maybe 8 tons as some "luxury" can in fact be the choice of material, maybe some very light compsits over the heavier standard etc.

to me Luxury is simply spending credits, swapping paint and changing out the little things.........

My concern however id that if "only spend credits" to gain actuall bonues to rolls, even if situational may be something that could lead to exploits.
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Dredwulf60
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 20, 2019 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You would probably need an additional game mechanic to gain a good tangible benefit from luxury.

My vice system was made for just such a situation.

It is the same type of idea behind the following situation: My character would like to get drunk and take spices...but since there is no game mechanic upside to it, and there is some obvious potential detriment...why would I bother to have the character indulge?

Same question; my character would probably enjoy living in a ship that is decked out with luxuries, but without an upside its a waste of credits. So why would I do it?

My system allows such intangibles to offset stress. But before it could do that, I had to define stress within the game; what it does and how it accumulates.

It's like creating a problem in order to sell the cure.
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Mamatried
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 20, 2019 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dredwulf60 wrote:
You would probably need an additional game mechanic to gain a good tangible benefit from luxury.

My vice system was made for just such a situation.

It is the same type of idea behind the following situation: My character would like to get drunk and take spices...but since there is no game mechanic upside to it, and there is some obvious potential detriment...why would I bother to have the character indulge?

Same question; my character would probably enjoy living in a ship that is decked out with luxuries, but without an upside its a waste of credits. So why would I do it?

My system allows such intangibles to offset stress. But before it could do that, I had to define stress within the game; what it does and how it accumulates.

It's like creating a problem in order to sell the cure.



I agree fully, I am just unsure if buying a +1 or even a +1D if so in lets say Bargain or some other Social Skill due to luxury.

I find it reasonable that during a negotiation a luxury environment would be a boost and a derelict and dirty one would give a penalty.

however should it be as simple as to "buy" this with credits alone, and if so what would it cost`?
A hight cost for game balance would realisitcally maybe even deny the organas the "propper" luxury
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 20, 2019 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For buying it to make sense, there would need to be other advantages.

Another possible option that I included was bonus CP for time spent aboard a luxurious vessel. My reasoning is that expending CP to improve skills is a measurement of time and effort expended while "off-screen," and that doing so in an environment where more of the character's personal needs are met frees up time for the character to engage in other pursuits.
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The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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