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"our Empire moment"
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2019 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahh.. More of the gritty dms then.
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Bren
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
Ahh.. More of the gritty dms then.
It was OD&D so I don't know that I'd say gritty exactly, but there certainly was no assumption that the PCs started out as heroes and in practice most PCs died before they reached 4th level.
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Leona Makk
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Joined: 03 Feb 2018
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Location: Minneapolis, MN

PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:04 pm    Post subject: Re: "our Empire moment" Reply with quote

Sutehp wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
"The more you have, the more can be taken from you." Jedi Master quote of the day


This reminds me of something Master Oogway said in Kung Fu Panda 3:

Master Oogway wrote:
"The more you take, the less you have."


Yeah, greed has been the downfall of numerous characters, noble and evil alike. And that has been a longtime theme in Star Wars, as demonstrated by Jedi Knights throughout the franchise trying to avoid attachment. And that especially includes conquering materialism in particular. I remember another Jedi quote, this one from the D20 WotC Jedi Sourcebook Power of the Jedi on page 32:

Master Kogoro wrote:
"I wear my robe so that I am warm; I carry my lightsaber that I am safe; and I keep enough credits for my next meal so that I am not hungry. If the Force wants me to have more, it finds a way of letting me know."

Leona Makk wrote:
OOOOH! That is a good one! I am totally using it!

And this idea of greed "ruining" RPGs has a bit of particular salience for me because I just finished a long session of Pathfinder today. For those of you who don't know about Pathfinder, it's essentially a Dark and Edgier version of D&D 3.5. (Pathfinder has been nicknamed "D&D 3.75 for a reason.) In the Pathfinder universe, PCs work for the Pathfinder Society, which is an organization of a bunch of Indiana Jones types who basically travel around the world of Golarion trying to gather magical artifacts from old tombs and dungeons in order to preserve them for posterity. So looting and graverobbing is actually part of the job description in Pathfinder. Fans have even nicknamed Pathfinders as "murder-hobos" since PCs are essentially homeless (because they're always traveling) who go around killing monsters in order to take their stuff.

But the session I was in today involves one of the later/deeper levels of a large dungeon designed to get characters from Level 1 all the way to Level 16. It's known as the Emerald Spire and each floor your party completes allows every character to gain a full level in just one session. Needless to say, this is an advanced dungeon and it has been known to kill even experienced players if the dice rolls do not favor you. Today, my group did (part of) the 11th floor of the Emerald Spire, known in-game as "The Tomb of Yarrix." The details of the session don't matter (and we ran long after 6 hours and are meeting again next week to finish the dungeon), but I can tell you that I and 1 other member of the party played clerics and both of us were needed to cast both Lesser Restoration and Restoration multiple times to heal party members from all the Constitution, Dexterity and Wisdom damage people were taking. This dungeon is that dangerous. I was a bit worried that I wasn't experienced enough to play a high-level cleric because at Level 10 the cleric spell list (that I'm still a bit unfamiliar with) is huge compared to the relatively low number available spell slots, but it turns out that the spells I prepared were almost exactly what the party needed. The rest of the party was extremely grateful for having two clerics in the group.
Leona Makk wrote:
Cleric is my favorite class is those games; but their work is never done! It can be a chore but they make the game so much easier (survivable)

My point is, for some RPG games like Pathfinder and D&D or video games like World of Warcraft and Diablo, tomb-robbing is par for the course; after all, the more gold and loot you get, the more powerful monsters you can take on. But in games of black and white morality like Star Wars, the point is to be the good guy who fights the good fight regardless of the personal cost. Any rewards you get might not be of the material kind, but rather will be of moral victories in saving lives or restoring democracy to a galaxy suffering under tyranny. And even if you get material gains, they're only a means to the end of defeating the Empire if you even get to keep the material gains and not have to turn them in to the Rebellion Quartermaster. The problem is that some players are so used to the "loot-and-scoot" mentality found in D&D and forget to set aside that mentality when they play games involving upholding good morals and "fighting the good fight" like Star Wars.

But then again, part of the job of the GM is to explain this to his players so that they go into the game knowing what the proper themes of the game are supposed to be. If the PCs ignore that and go off on their own thing, then the GM should have no problem inflicting the (entirely foreseeable) consequences of the PCs' actions on them. Karma (or the Force) can be a b!tch, after all.


Leona Makk wrote:
I think I do need to improve as a GM when it comes to explaining the expectations. Perhaps the sage advice of a Failed Jedi NPC or a sleeping Knight of Old like at the end of the FarStar campaign. Someone who knows better. Thanks for the advice.
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Leona Makk
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Joined: 03 Feb 2018
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
After this adventure, I am hoping to steer everyone towards the ultimate sandbox...MINOS Cluster. Maybe I will rein MY story ideas a bit and practice objectivity there.

Oddly enough, one of the set-ups for the Minos Cluster is that the PCs are sent their because it's too hot for them everywhere else. GG6 lays out in detail how the characters are basically on the run and Alliance Command sends them to Minos on a low-key mission running a tramp freighter (and gathering intel and making contacts).

If you manage to get them there, I'll need to step up my game on the Ship Modification and After Market Parts...


Leona Makk wrote:
AHA! Thanks! Just read that adventure setup and I think its perfect. GG6 is so solid!
I think I might have Alliance Command "call" in a panic and under attack as the Empire retaliates for all the players' overt actions. The cover is blown. The ISB has detailed intel on the players! Run for it!!! (that sort of thing)
I have been dropping hints about Minos being a backwater for the whole campaign so I am sure they will take the bait.

As for After Market Parts, I think introducing the "GM's Paradise" of the Black Market will keep the players running for the fresh credits. Now there art two Black Market gangsters in the book; (the Twilek and the Arcona?) so maybe their will be some good Bargain and Con opportunities.
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Leona Makk
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
After this adventure, I am hoping to steer everyone towards the ultimate sandbox...MINOS Cluster. Maybe I will rein MY story ideas a bit and practice objectivity there.

You may find this helpful.

New Minos Sector Map (w/ Elrood Sector)


Oh wow! This is super useful! Thanks!

I noticed a of new system: Teh'Jar? Any info on that one?
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Whill
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leona Makk wrote:
Whill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
After this adventure, I am hoping to steer everyone towards the ultimate sandbox...MINOS Cluster. Maybe I will rein MY story ideas a bit and practice objectivity there.

You may find this helpful.

New Minos Sector Map (w/ Elrood Sector)

Oh wow! This is super useful! Thanks!

You're most certainly welcome.


Leona Makk wrote:
I noticed a of new system: Teh'Jar? Any info on that one?

It's not new. It's a WEG-canon system. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Teh%27Jar_II

Whill wrote:
I added Teh'Jar (a Minos Cluster world mentioned in Heroes & Rogues) to the southwestern sector... I gave Gesaril's GG6 chart numbers to Teh'Jar...

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CRMcNeill
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Joined: 05 Apr 2010
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting...

One of the references to the Wookieepedia article refers to an Essential Atlas Online Companion. I'd never heard of this before...
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Leona Makk
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Joined: 03 Feb 2018
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Location: Minneapolis, MN

PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
Whill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
After this adventure, I am hoping to steer everyone towards the ultimate sandbox...MINOS Cluster. Maybe I will rein MY story ideas a bit and practice objectivity there.

You may find this helpful.

New Minos Sector Map (w/ Elrood Sector)

Oh wow! This is super useful! Thanks!

You're most certainly welcome.


Leona Makk wrote:
I noticed a of new system: Teh'Jar? Any info on that one?

It's not new. It's a WEG-canon system. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Teh%27Jar_II

Whill wrote:
I added Teh'Jar (a Minos Cluster world mentioned in Heroes & Rogues) to the southwestern sector... I gave Gesaril's GG6 chart numbers to Teh'Jar...



Totally pulled out my copy of Heroes & Rogues in under 60 seconds. Yikes. The article mentions something called the Sky Stone. Never heard of this story but it is food for thought.
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Whill
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leona Makk wrote:
Whill wrote:
Leona Makk wrote:
I noticed a of new system: Teh'Jar? Any info on that one?

It's not new. It's a WEG-canon system. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Teh%27Jar_II

Whill wrote:
I added Teh'Jar (a Minos Cluster world mentioned in Heroes & Rogues) to the southwestern sector... I gave Gesaril's GG6 chart numbers to Teh'Jar...


Totally pulled out my copy of Heroes & Rogues in under 60 seconds. Yikes. The article mentions something called the Sky Stone. Never heard of this story but it is food for thought.

Teh'Jar and the Sky Stone was just an cool adventure hook written into as the capsule for an NPC at the back of Heroes and Rogues. It's tied in with what I want to do with the Minos Cluster Campaign (related to the adventure idea for Mestra in GG6). When I was researching other fan maps for the Minos Cluster, it was quite common for them to have a bunch of systems the GM made up, which means a lot to him and his players, but not so much to everyone else on the internet. So for my map I only added a couple systems that weren't in GG6, and both of those are other EU systems. This was a WEG system. Any GMs using my map are still free to add whatever they want. I am adding an another inhabited planet to the Teh'Jar system.

CRMcNeill wrote:
Interesting...

One of the references to the Wookieepedia article refers to an Essential Atlas Online Companion. I'd never heard of this before...

Almost every EU system has the Essential Atlas and/or the online companion as a reference due to the appendix of system locations on the galactic grid. In this case it is just where the Minos Cluster sector is.
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