The Rancor Pit Forum Index
Welcome to The Rancor Pit forums!

The Rancor Pit Forum Index
FAQ   ::   Search   ::   Memberlist   ::   Usergroups   ::   Register   ::   Profile   ::   Log in to check your private messages   ::   Log in

Shields Below 1D
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Rancor Pit Forum Index -> House Rules -> Shields Below 1D
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Director of Engineering


Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 14042
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 1:54 am    Post subject: Shields Below 1D Reply with quote

When I was doing stat write-ups for X-Wing: Alliance, I came across something of a poser. The baseline ship I used for conversion was the X-Wing, with its 1D of Shields. However, several of the "lesser" starfighters in the game have lower Shield ratings than the X-Wing. If I'd gone for a straight conversion, their Shield stats would've rated 0D+1 or 0D+2, which is hardly worth having, really. The 1D MAP from shifting arcs on such weak shields would actually be more of a penalty than any protection they'd provide.

While I'm not aware of any official stats with a rating that low, I can think of at least one example under the RAW where such a circumstance might occur. A Y-Wing, with its 1D+2 Shields, could suffer Light Damage to its Shields (-1D to Shields), and be reduced to an effective 0D+2.

My interim solution at the time (at least one of my stat conversions had weak shields) was to incorporate the shields into the craft's Particle Shielding, giving the Hull a bump of +1 or +2.

Now, based on a suggestion from Totally Not An ISB Agent, there actually is a way for weak shields to be usable, albeit at much greater difficulty.

Have any of you ever used ships of less than 1D, and if so, how?
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Whill
Supreme Chancellor (Owner/Admin)


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 7699
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ship stats tend to have whole dice for shields, but there are some exceptions, and I do not see why there shouldn't be. In fact, your MC-19 has 1D+2 for shields.

Yes, the way I've always handled that is if you have a pipped shield stat and you lose dice in shields down to the pips (0D+1 or 0D+2), the pips can still protect the ship. Also, a precedent exists in D6 Space, where it is explicit that when you split up shield dice for allocation to fire arcs, you can split each die up into three pips.

It's funny I just posted a proposed shield tweak involving pips before seeing this.
_________________
*
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration & Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Director of Engineering


Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 14042
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went back and double-checked, and it's actually more of an issue than I thought. Here's a list of the ship's I've done stats for that had shields rated less than the X-Wing's (with the X-Wing provided as a reference):
    Ship = X-W:A DPF Rating
    X-Wing = 50
    T-Wing = 20
    R-41 = 30
    TIE/X-M2 = 20*
    TIE/X-M3 = 30*
    TIE/X-M5 = 20*

    *Optional
By those numbers, every ship stat in the X-Wing: Alliance topic should have a Shield rating of 0D+1 or 0D+2. Going by the X-Wing stats, the cut-off for 0D+1 would be ~16.67, and ~33.3 for 0D+2. I'm considering the following:
    X-W:A DPF Rating = WEG Shields
    1-17 = 0D+1
    18-33 = 0D+2
    34+ = 1D

_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
LTAaripJasall
Ensign
Ensign


Joined: 03 Mar 2016
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could subtract pips from the shield rating. (Minimum 0)

18-33 Shield: 1D-1
1-17 Shield: 1D-2
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Director of Engineering


Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 14042
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LTAaripJasall wrote:
You could subtract pips from the shield rating. (Minimum 0)

Shield: 1D-1
Shield: 1D-2

It's an interesting thought, but how would you apply that to the RAW? Per the rules, how would you split 1D-2 to cover two separate arcs?
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
LTAaripJasall
Ensign
Ensign


Joined: 03 Mar 2016
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I may have been so enamored with the idea of subtracting pips that I didn’t think through how it would work all the way.

Perhaps emitters that weak can only cover one arc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Director of Engineering


Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 14042
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LTAaripJasall wrote:
I may have been so enamored with the idea of subtracting pips that I didn’t think through how it would work all the way.

It's an intriguing possibility, and I can see it potentially being useful under other circumstances where you aren't required to split the dice.

Quote:
Perhaps emitters that weak can only cover one arc.

That'd be an option for low-end, civilian-grade shields. Military ones would need the versatility.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Mamatried
Commodore
Commodore


Joined: 16 Dec 2017
Posts: 1347
Location: Norway

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

couls a 0+1 or just a +1 to shields actyally be rules as basically as simple as adding +1 to the ship hull, and problem solved.


We do have armor with pip penalties, the scout trooper beingg one with a +2 penalty to dex, and can not shields below zero be "ruled" the same-ish.

as above the ship have 2Dhull and a 0D+2 Shileds, when attacked can we not either reduce the attack roll by 2 or add +2 to hull?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Whill
Supreme Chancellor (Owner/Admin)


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 7699
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree.

Whill wrote:
Ship stats tend to have whole dice for shields, but there are some exceptions, and I do not see why there shouldn't be. In fact, your MC-19 has 1D+2 for shields.

Yes, the way I've always handled that is if you have a pipped shield stat and you lose dice in shields down to the pips (0D+1 or 0D+2), the pips can still protect the ship. Also, a precedent exists in D6 Space, where it is explicit that when you split up shield dice for allocation to fire arcs, you can split each die up into three pips.

We don't need to reinvent the wheel here. R&E gave us a rule and examples that just don't happen to include pips, since most ship stats have shield dice be whole dice without pips. D6 Space explicitly said how to handle pips: You handle them same as whole dice (and whole dice can be split into three pips).

Pips aren't hardly worth having. Pips are the natural gradient within D6, and every little bit helps from a statistical standpoint.

1 pip = 1
2 pips = 2
1D ~ 3.5

Stats with negative pips do provide different gradients.

1D-2 ~ 1.5
1D-1 ~ 2.5

But negatively pipped shield stats would only make sense with a minimum die code of 1D, so they could not separated from 1D when splitting shield dice. So if you had a ship with a shields stat of 2D-1, you could allocate 1D to one arc (or split the 1D into three pips) and then allocate 1D-1 one arc. That makes negative pip stats less useful, so I wouldn't suggest bothering with them.
_________________
*
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration & Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Rancor Pit Forum Index -> House Rules All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group


v2.0