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Ammo and the games
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dredwulf60 wrote:

Integrity is like virginity. Once you lose it...you can't get really get it back.

But forgiveness is a virtue; just because you lost virginity doesn't mean you have to end up in the red light district the rest of your life..


I had a major laugh at that analogy!
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Whill
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dredwulf60 wrote:
He had to sit out several sessions, but the group voted to allow him back in, though as a supporting character.

Integrity is like virginity. Once you lose it...you can't get really get it back.

But forgiveness is a virtue; just because you lost virginity doesn't mean you have to end up in the red light district the rest of your life.

Suffice to say that my group keeps an eye out for abuses now.

Good story. Props to the cheater for fessin' and to your group for forgiveness.

Dredwulf60 wrote:
And it's hard to prove unless you do the work to prove it. Politeness being what it is...you don't want to call someone out unless you *know*.

It's not a lot of work. I've always kept a record of how each PCs starts at char gen, and how many CPs awarded to each PC for each adventure. Sometime over the years I added a stat to my character sheet that includes a running total number of CPs spent on increasing skills. There is no need to calculate averages. It's only a little work to do an audit if I ever wanted to, but hardly any work to just make sure there isn't even a single discrepancy from adventure to adventure. Mistakes are discovered very quickly.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keeping track of CP awarded, CP spent on actions, and CP used for advancement are all pretty easy to do. As a GM I eventually have some PC notes anyway.

Then again, sometimes either I or a player forgets to add or subtract something, and a small disparity might ensue. It could go on for a few sessions, and I might just let it slide anyway because +/- 1-3 CP is no big deal IMO 8)

Nobody in roleplaying is asked to take impeccable, inerrant notes Embarassed
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Dredwulf60
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It's not a lot of work.


Well, that's easy to say when you DO keep track of it.

I mean, it's not hard to discover NOW.

But it was lot of work THEN to go from a position of total trust in the personal honour of your players...to a position of some suspicion, but not really believing...to a position of firm suspicion but not wanting to make an accusation you can't back up with evidence.

So, it's not a lot of work when you keep track of things like expenditures.

Which brings us back to the original point:
Keeping track of ammo...IS a fair bit of work. So much so that some people don't want to bother; or its not an important enough concept in their game to worry about.

In my game, we have established that having some vague idea that there is a limit to how much you can shoot is desirable. But not enough to make everyone keep a running total of every blaster bolt expended...and track when people aren't keeping track, through mistake or willful neglect...which my experience shows CAN happen.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2016 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO if you start off with doing it, then it shouldn't be much more work than normal..

Take a shot, make a tick on a blank piece of note paper.. Tally up the ticks at the end of the battle.. quick and simple.
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2016 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel like the topic has kind of derailed from tracking ammo to catching potential cheaters.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raven Redstar wrote:
I feel like the topic has kind of derailed from tracking ammo to catching potential cheaters.

The two topics kind of go hand-in-hand, particularly since keeping track of ammo would be just ONE MORE THING for a GM to do if the players didn't do it. And unfortunately, you always think you know your friends. But in some people, gaming creates this monstrous urge to win, so badly sometimes that they end up cheating.

I'll be the first GM to say that most microcheating is fine with me. It's not worth it to kick a guy out because his bookkeeping is inconsistent or favorable to him.

Anyway, I would definitely say the two topics of "player vs. GM bookkeeping of ammo" and "cheating via bookkeeping" are definitely related. I am one of the ones who doesn't really care if you ever explicitly tell me you're replacing your power pack.

The solution, at least for me, is to stick with the winners. These are the folks who do what they say they are going to do. They don't cheat, and if they see others doing so they will quietly let you know. I am lucky to know a few gamers that fit this description.
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Kytross
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2016 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Collect character sheets at the end of the session.
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Methedor
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello folks.

My players keep track of ammo even with he ridiculous amount of shot.
Something that I have done when there are hordes around or for sufficiently cinematic moments over time where combat is involved is have the PCs roll there blaster sill against a difficulty and for every point above the difficulty a shot is expended also signifying that a Generic Soldier\Creature is down. A failure means that during the fighting some foes slipped through your or your companions fire and has gotten closer to you or point blank depending.

they of course get a dodge roll to signify they too are being shot at.

during my Halloween special the Home Station crew (a few million as the base is a colossal sized thing) was abducted\controlled by a dream controlling device and with blasters to stun the PCs had to get to various locations expending shots along the way while trying to avoid the foes own stun weapons to not fall prey to the Dream Controller.

aside from that my players rarely run out of blaster ammo aside from damaged weapons "bleeding" ammo from damage, a Wild dice complications, using "High-output" settings on custom guns or energy draining devices.

As an aside some figured out that Lucid Dreaming provided a key to influence the situation.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2021 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Dredwulf60 wrote:
Those who might not want to contaminate their D6 game with strange other shapes could likely work out something with D6s if they really wanted to do something like this.

Here's a D6 take on this concept:
    All Blaster Weapons have an Ammunition Rating, listed as 1D, 2D, 3D, etc...

    On a Wild Die result when firing the Blaster, roll the Blaster's Ammunition against Very Easy Difficulty.

    On a Success, the Blaster can continue firing; on a Failure, it runs out and must be reloaded.

    However, each Success increases the Difficulty for the next Ammunition roll (from Very Easy to Easy, and so on).

    As a result, even on a Success, the shooter will know his weapon is starting to run low...

Giving this a bump because I'm thinking strongly about using it as an ammo limiter for the missile weapons I'm putting on capital ships. It's logical to assume that capital ships are going to have much greater magazine capacity than starfighters and space transports, but it isn't going to be bottomless, either. As such, instead of giving capital ships weapon counts in the dozens or hundreds, I'm thinking of giving them D codes instead, using the rules above.

On top of that, it would also work to give ships multiple D codes based on the different types of weapons, so that low-end missiles would have a larger supply, but more expensive things like my Hunter anti-starfighter missiles would only have enough ammo for a few salvos, if that.

Thoughts?
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Darklighter79
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2021 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
CRMcNeill wrote:
Dredwulf60 wrote:
Those who might not want to contaminate their D6 game with strange other shapes could likely work out something with D6s if they really wanted to do something like this.

Here's a D6 take on this concept:
    All Blaster Weapons have an Ammunition Rating, listed as 1D, 2D, 3D, etc...

    On a Wild Die result when firing the Blaster, roll the Blaster's Ammunition against Very Easy Difficulty.

    On a Success, the Blaster can continue firing; on a Failure, it runs out and must be reloaded.

    However, each Success increases the Difficulty for the next Ammunition roll (from Very Easy to Easy, and so on).

    As a result, even on a Success, the shooter will know his weapon is starting to run low...

Giving this a bump because I'm thinking strongly about using it as an ammo limiter for the missile weapons I'm putting on capital ships. It's logical to assume that capital ships are going to have much greater magazine capacity than starfighters and space transports, but it isn't going to be bottomless, either. As such, instead of giving capital ships weapon counts in the dozens or hundreds, I'm thinking of giving them D codes instead, using the rules above.

On top of that, it would also work to give ships multiple D codes based on the different types of weapons, so that low-end missiles would have a larger supply, but more expensive things like my Hunter anti-starfighter missiles would only have enough ammo for a few salvos, if that.

Thoughts?


I would implement Hull D factor into this as this represents size and massiveness of a vessel. You can have the same type of a missile weapon installed on ships of a different sizes and their ammo capacity would differ due to the vessel scale and the space that could be adapted to weapons systems. I have omitted 'cargo capacity' intentionally as I see a weapon system as one integrated mechanism - cannon, targeting system, auto reload mechanism with different capacity depending on the space available. Cargo capacity may be treated as backup for ammo, but then it would require to be transported to battle stations first and placed into shell/ammo/rocket compartments.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darklighter79 wrote:
I would implement Hull D factor into this as this represents size and massiveness of a vessel. You can have the same type of a missile weapon installed on ships of a different sizes and their ammo capacity would differ due to the vessel scale and the space that could be adapted to weapons systems.

Hull size relative to the weapons will absolutely be a factor, but there's going to be a great deal of guesswork involved.

Quote:
I have omitted 'cargo capacity' intentionally as I see a weapon system as one integrated mechanism - cannon, targeting system, auto reload mechanism with different capacity depending on the space available. Cargo capacity may be treated as backup for ammo, but then it would require to be transported to battle stations first and placed into shell/ammo/rocket compartments.

No ship captain in their right mind would stow something as volatile as ordnance anywhere other than dedicated magazines. That's just asking for trouble (see British Battlecruiser losses at the Battle of Jutland). The only time I could ever see ordnance as cargo would be on a dedicated resupply ship, slated to replenish the stores of actual combatants.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:

No ship captain in their right mind would stow something as volatile as ordnance anywhere other than dedicated magazines. That's just asking for trouble (see British Battlecruiser losses at the Battle of Jutland). The only time I could ever see ordnance as cargo would be on a dedicated resupply ship, slated to replenish the stores of actual combatants.


OR via smugglers, trying to do arms runs, under the table!
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