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Telsij
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShootingWomprats wrote:
I have actually seen both twin and quads on the Volt Cobra. Not sure what the citation is. Here is the image. Red circles denote quads, the yellow denote something else. Could be missile launchers. Oddly, I know 1-2 escape pods release from under the sides, but I do not see anything that looks like them.

I should have phrased my suggestion better, and made mention of that originally.

What I should have said, is the great majority of the artwork of the Volt Cobra, including the more recent, is predominately dual. I'd estimate number of instances is about a margin of two to one, issues as well as single images, dual vs. quad.

That said, the better-drawn artwork by Stuart Immonen often (but not always) shows quads. So up to you. The other specifics mentioned make actual game mechanics differences (2D vs 3D thinking) that both Whill and I have experienced first hand (and that you've incorporated), so no biggie re: this aesthetic one!

Also, I'm glad you mentioned you yourself had seen both quads and dual. I usually have doubts you've actually done the firsthand reading, hence my more "firm" / definite statement earlier, but you surprised me!

Re: the two larger underslung cylinders, I'm more inclined to make those boosters of some sort rather than offensive weaponry, which is already worked into increased maneuverability and/or Space speed rating.
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shootingwomprats
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Telsij wrote:
Also, I'm glad you mentioned you yourself had seen both quads and dual. I usually have doubts you've actually done the firsthand reading, hence my more "firm" / definite statement earlier, but you surprised me!


People and how they approach projects change over time. As do the amount of time they choose to spend on a project. I think I have also just gotten better at creating stats. Your noticing is appreciated.
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Telsij
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:09 am    Post subject: Volt Cobra Turret Guns - "Definitive" Evidence! Reply with quote

It's a QUAD cannons vs. DUAL cannons extravaganza!

-------------------------------------------------------------------

So thanks to my OCD and insomnia, I went through the known appearances of the Volt Cobra to date and checked the comics themselves.

The verdict: DUAL still wins! But not by nearly as large a margin as I initially thought!

A number of the issues listed for the Volt Cobra appearances did not include a dorsal view or were shots at too great a distance to be conclusive (and are not included below), but the following issues DID provide conclusive looks.

The tallies, from the 2015 (and onward) volume of the Marvel Star Wars series and the Doctor Aphra series, Volumes I and II are as follows:


QUAD: 4 issues

Star Wars #9
Star Wars #10 (both Quad and Dual)
Star Wars #11
Doctor Aphra, Volume I, #22

DUAL: 5 issues

Star Wars #8 (Shows Voice-activation and high damage capability, more on this later)
Star Wars #10 (both Quad and Dual)
Star Wars #56
Star Wars #61
Doctor Aphra, Volume II, #7 (2020)


Notes: The total number of dual-cannon images is greater than the images of the quad, despite having only the one issue edge. The more recent issues almost exclusively lean toward dual as well. This is likely what led to my over-estimation of the dual cannon's margin of victory.

However, the (imho) better-drawn -- and original -- design by Stuart Immonen, more often shows quad lasers.

------------------------------

OTHER ITEMS OF NOTE:

  • NO GUNS AT ALL IN CLEAR DORSAL/OVERHEAD VIEW :

    Star Wars Annual #4
    Star Wars #16

    Imho, this should be reconciled as the Volt Cobra having retractable turrets.


  • UNDERSLUNG CYLINDERS SHOWN AS ENGINES/THRUSTERS OF SOME KIND:

    Star Wars #34



    Star Wars #36



    (Cobra's sensor dish is also shown as off-center however and not central — though that's also easily chalked up to artistic license, much like the quad/dual differences)


  • VOICE-COMMAND TURRET IS POWERFUL WEAPON:

    ShootingWomprats wrote:
    I thought she also had voice command of guns on her ship as well? Am I remembering that incorrectly?
    ...
    This is a good idea. The ship is customized and as its a small ship I am sure Sana would have made some upgrades to improve weapon damage.

    In Star Wars #8, one dorsal, dual turret which Sana activated via voice-command — "Cobra: Target one and fire" — managed to completely obliterate a docked Lambda-class shuttle (4D hull) in what looked like just one or two fire-linked volleys. This issue provides hard evidence to point to re: voice-control and a higher damage code.


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Last edited by Telsij on Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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shootingwomprats
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Telsij wrote:
So thanks to my ... insomnia ...


You and me both brother.

Telsij wrote:
[*]UNDERSLUNG CYLINDERS SHOWN AS ENGINES/THRUSTERS OF SOME KIND:


Probably lateral ion thrusters.

Telsij wrote:
[*]VOICE-COMMAND TURRET IS POWERFUL WEAPON:
In Star Wars #8, one dorsal, dual turret which Sana activated via voice-command — "Cobra: Target one and fire" — managed to completely obliterate a docked Lambda-class shuttle (4D hull) in what looked like just one or two fire-linked volleys. This issue provides hard evidence to point to re: voice-control and a higher damage code.


Excellent, then I did not remember it incorrectly and will add this to the Volt Cobra and her comlink. As an aside, in the games I run, ships that are powered down are -1D to Hull Strength. I have toyed with the idea of reducing the scale to speeder as well, but not tried this yet.
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Telsij
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

- Re: OCD and insomnia, haha! True! I have to wake up early for work however, and feeling compelled to devote time to this at this hour, is detrimental in the end. Alas. And with more work/creative commitments coming up as soon as end of the week, I’ll prob have to step back again for a while.

My primary concern is that I don’t want good characters to wind up in widely seen sourcebooks with half-baked stats, or underdeveloped / under-researched stats that are missing crucial or interesting elements. I’m glad to see you putting more first-hand research into your work! I know you’ve given a lot and I’m not trying to attack all the generous effort you’ve given over the years! Just please do not rush just for the sake of completion or prolific output, at the expense of quality! Don’t let me (and the readers/characters) down, Don! (I say that as warmly and genuinely as possible)

- Re: damage vs a powered down ship. Even with your -1D to damage resistance, the guns would have to do at least 6D damage to achieve at least a 13-15 damage result on an above average roll, and that was the baseline I was getting at.

Toward that end, speaking of GMing vs writing stats, in games I run, I don’t use initiative — I use First Edition’s “highest roll for first actions goes first,” but that doesn’t mean I don’t write mechanics with traditional 2E initiative in mind as well. The powering down rule isn’t the focus of my point though. (That rule makes sense, I know it was said only as an aside, and I even recall similar optional effects in RAW). As much as I imbue my write-ups with the POV of my own game style and my own house rules, I still try to stat things so that the intended effect makes sense across the board, and not in a way that can only be achieved or negated via my house rule.

Either way, will have to hang back for the next few weeks!

Glad you’re incorporating my changes, not for my sake or for credit, but only in the interests of giving the reader, and fellow SW GM/player the most developed picture possible. Honest best wishes!
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Forceally
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fyzen Gor: You said you adjusted the dates. You did. Now we have 10 ABY and 17 ABY. So the first one is 17 BBY, and the second one is 10 ABY, right? You have cyborgin instead of cyborging twice, Ponits instead of Points, and perception based instead of Perception-based. Medicine is an advanced skill, so all instances of medicine should have (A) in front of it.


Did you remove archaeology from Sana Starros' stats, or did you decide to leave them there.


Last edited by Forceally on Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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shootingwomprats
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forceally wrote:
Fyzen Gor: You said you adjusted the dates. You did. Now we have 10 ABY and 17 ABY. So the first one is 17 BBY, and the second one is 10 ABY, right?


Yes the first set of stats is him as a medical student/scientist in 17 BBY. The second set is him as a cyborg cultist in 10 BBY. This was addressed and posted in the link provided below.

Forceally wrote:
You have cyborgin instead of cyborging twice ...


I have changed cyborgin/cyborging to cybernetics to avoid future confusion.

Forceally wrote:
Did you remove archaeology from Sana Starros' stats, or did you decide to leave them there.


Already answered this here
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Forceally
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any updates on the progress of this?
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