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DarthMortis Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Sep 2008 Posts: 124 Location: Moorhead
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Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:18 am Post subject: |
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Ankhanu wrote: |
That's part of why I made a Wookiee Jedi for Vong's PbP Fading Light here on the Pit. Wookiee are not well suited to the Jedi life... |
I don't really agree with this too much, there are those in the Jedi order who focus on Lightsaber and not much more, a Wookiee would make a good Jedi swordsman _________________ "I believe the Jedi are weak so they give up their emotions. I believe the Sith are weak so they give up to their emotions. I lay somewhere in the middle, not afraid to keep my emotions, but afraid to lose myself in them." - Daroth Mortanis |
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Rerun941 Commander
Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 459 Location: San Antonio, TX
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Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:48 am Post subject: |
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DarthMortis wrote: | Ankhanu wrote: |
That's part of why I made a Wookiee Jedi for Vong's PbP Fading Light here on the Pit. Wookiee are not well suited to the Jedi life... |
I don't really agree with this too much, there are those in the Jedi order who focus on Lightsaber and not much more, a Wookiee would make a good Jedi swordsman |
I think Ankhanu was referring to the usual temperment of a Wookiee and not their particular skills.
Berserker Rage kinda goes against the tenants of the Jedi Code. _________________ Han - "How're we doin'?"
Luke - "Same as always."
Han - "That bad, huh?" |
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Ankhanu Vice Admiral
Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 3089 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:58 am Post subject: |
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Rerun941 wrote: | I think Ankhanu was referring to the usual temperment of a Wookiee and not their particular skills.
Berserker Rage kinda goes against the tenants of the Jedi Code. |
Co-rekt.
Wookiees are emotional, temperamental beings; the average Wookiee is essentially the polar opposite of what a Jedi should be... calm, collected, serene. I doubt those adjectives even exist in Shyriiwook
In a single battle, the character managed to pick up 2 DSPs while acting nobly... but emotionally. _________________ Hotaru no Hishou; a messageboard about games, friends and nothing at all.
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garhkal Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005 Posts: 14034 Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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True. Lobaca had that issues in the young jedi knight series. _________________ Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk! |
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DarthMortis Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Sep 2008 Posts: 124 Location: Moorhead
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Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:25 am Post subject: |
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Wookiee's may be emotional, but they aren't stupid. If a Wookiee thought it couldn't make it as a Jedi, AKA, if a Wookiee didn't think he could keep his emotes in check I doubt he would try for the path that could some day lead him to the Dark Side. It also seems that Wookiee's have good relations with Jedi for the most part
But I guess for the most part I wasn't thinking about the emotional as much as the focus on skills. _________________ "I believe the Jedi are weak so they give up their emotions. I believe the Sith are weak so they give up to their emotions. I lay somewhere in the middle, not afraid to keep my emotions, but afraid to lose myself in them." - Daroth Mortanis |
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Esoomian High Admiral
Joined: 29 Oct 2003 Posts: 6207 Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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DarthMortis wrote: | Wookiee's may be emotional, but they aren't stupid. If a Wookiee thought it couldn't make it as a Jedi, AKA, if a Wookiee didn't think he could keep his emotes in check I doubt he would try for the path that could some day lead him to the Dark Side. It also seems that Wookiee's have good relations with Jedi for the most part
But I guess for the most part I wasn't thinking about the emotional as much as the focus on skills. |
Not sure I agree there, I think if a Wookiee ends up with the capacity for being a Jedi it's more of a luck of the draw thing than a 'I decided I wanted to be a Jedi so I studied the force' type idea. I know in the game system you can start out non-foce sensitive, then become force-sensitive and then study to be a Jedi but most of the books I've read seem to support the hypothesis that you're either born with the capacity to be a Jedi or you're not.
If a Wookiee was born with the capacity I think he'd need to seek out the Jedi and train to master his emotions otherwise he'd almost certainly fall to the dark side.
If a race has a reputation for tearing off limbs when the loose at board games then a force sensitive Wookiee is probably closer to the dark side than the light. _________________ Don't waste money on expensive binoculars.
Simply stand closer to the object you wish to view. |
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Delkarnu Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 02 Sep 2008 Posts: 189 Location: Saratoga Springs, Upstate NY
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Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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With their low knowledge attribute and strong emotions, they would need a lot of D in Willpower to keep the Berserker Rage in check, plus how many DSPs they would earn before they made the perception check to get out of it, especially once a Dark Side Jedi goes after them or their close friends (large Strength doesn't help you resist most Force Powers) and they get horrible visions through the force. |
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Ankhanu Vice Admiral
Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 3089 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:17 am Post subject: |
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Esoom and Del make pretty good points concerning the lacking stats Wookiees suffer from regarding Force use (and remaining light side, that is), but a character is so very much more than Attributes and skills; those numbers mean so very little when considering what makes a species or individual suited for a particular path. A species' disposition is not reflected in the numbers placed on the character sheet, it's something that's intrinsic to the esence of playing or representing the species, something that you as a player (and your GM if they actually care about character) have to take into consideration. It's all about the age old gamer schism between roleplay and rollplay.
While there are some minor drawbacks or difficulties to playing a Jedi Wookiee based on dice, they're absolutely minor compared to the difficulties posed by the intangible (stat wise) aspects of Wookiee nature/disposition. A Jedi Wookiee is constantly in battle with their instinctive nature; they have to fight and control their impulses even more than, say, a human. Getting inside that mindset, that perspective, to play the character and the inner conflict well poses a lot of challenges for the player and the character. You won't always play something that is to your, as a character, advantage, but is sensible to what the character would do in a given situation. It can be tough making those decision that you as a player know are bad, but your character might think are good or sensible, or natural.
Of course, these things don't really come up in a rollplay game; it's all about the stats and finding the most efficient and advantageous course of action, whether it's something your character would come up with or not. It's all in your style of play.
</ramble> _________________ Hotaru no Hishou; a messageboard about games, friends and nothing at all.
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jmanski Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 06 Mar 2005 Posts: 2065 Location: Kansas
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Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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Thats what roleplaying is all about. I think we all get a little too carried away with the roll playing. Its nice to focus on the character sometimes, too. _________________ Blasted rules. Why can't they just be perfect? |
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Delkarnu Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 02 Sep 2008 Posts: 189 Location: Saratoga Springs, Upstate NY
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Posted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:49 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, my post sounded more rules lawyering than role playing, but I meant it more that the stats a player puts down on a page should reflect the personality of the character.
If the player has CP to spend and chooses to increase their lightsaber skill rather than their willpower, would show to me as a GM that the character is focused on improving their power, not themselves(and rollplaying as opposed to roleplaying). I would hold them more at risk of going into a rage as they struggle to keep their increased abilities in check.
If the character is committed to controlling their emotions, and fighting their biological nature, when CP's are available, a good roleplayer would increase the characters willpower in my opinion, to reflect the characters struggle to control his/her emotions.
I would love to have a player play a Wookie Jedi, starting with a low ability to keep his emotions in check, and struggling (and sometimes failing) and improving with time. That type of player will always be allowed to Roleplay over rollplaying in a game I'm running.
If a player decided to play a Wookie Jedi put his STR and Dex at max, and skimped on their perception and knowledge, and put their CP into force skills and combat abilities, I would Rollplay them exactly how they are rollplaying. |
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Lostboy Commander
Joined: 22 Aug 2008 Posts: 384
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Posted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:32 am Post subject: |
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One of the strangest force users i have ever encountered was a dathomirian rancor named "Blarp" now that was a rollplaying experience. |
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DarthMortis Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 Sep 2008 Posts: 124 Location: Moorhead
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Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:38 am Post subject: |
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Delkarnu wrote: | Yeah, my post sounded more rules lawyering than role playing, but I meant it more that the stats a player puts down on a page should reflect the personality of the character.
If the player has CP to spend and chooses to increase their lightsaber skill rather than their willpower, would show to me as a GM that the character is focused on improving their power, not themselves(and rollplaying as opposed to roleplaying). I would hold them more at risk of going into a rage as they struggle to keep their increased abilities in check.
If the character is committed to controlling their emotions, and fighting their biological nature, when CP's are available, a good roleplayer would increase the characters willpower in my opinion, to reflect the characters struggle to control his/her emotions.
I would love to have a player play a Wookie Jedi, starting with a low ability to keep his emotions in check, and struggling (and sometimes failing) and improving with time. That type of player will always be allowed to Roleplay over rollplaying in a game I'm running.
If a player decided to play a Wookie Jedi put his STR and Dex at max, and skimped on their perception and knowledge, and put their CP into force skills and combat abilities, I would Rollplay them exactly how they are rollplaying. |
So...let me get this straight...you think that a person using their natural strengths and weakness' in a path that they choose to take to their advantage is "rollplaying"? ...Yeah...makes no sense to me, I can see a character wanting good Willpower to resist the temptations of the darkside, but just because they want to focus on Lightsaber over other things doesn't mean it's not part of the character. "My character is a Wookiee Jedi. He knows that his path is difficult, but he is naturally oriented towards physical abilities and he thinks that is the best path on his way to Knighthood."
Just because someone focuses in Str/Dex, doesn't mean they can't throw a few starting dice into Willpower as well. If I had a 5D strength Wookiee and what...3-4D Dex? Not sure on the max for Wookiees, I would probably spend 2 of my starting dice to put into Willpower anyway, bringing it up to 4D if I had 2D. _________________ "I believe the Jedi are weak so they give up their emotions. I believe the Sith are weak so they give up to their emotions. I lay somewhere in the middle, not afraid to keep my emotions, but afraid to lose myself in them." - Daroth Mortanis |
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Delkarnu Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 02 Sep 2008 Posts: 189 Location: Saratoga Springs, Upstate NY
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Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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DarthMortis wrote: | So...let me get this straight...you think that a person using their natural strengths and weakness' in a path that they choose to take to their advantage is "rollplaying"? ...Yeah...makes no sense to me, I can see a character wanting good Willpower to resist the temptations of the darkside, but just because they want to focus on Lightsaber over other things doesn't mean it's not part of the character. "My character is a Wookiee Jedi. He knows that his path is difficult, but he is naturally oriented towards physical abilities and he thinks that is the best path on his way to Knighthood."
Just because someone focuses in Str/Dex, doesn't mean they can't throw a few starting dice into Willpower as well. If I had a 5D strength Wookiee and what...3-4D Dex? Not sure on the max for Wookiees, I would probably spend 2 of my starting dice to put into Willpower anyway, bringing it up to 4D if I had 2D. |
It depends, if the player boosts lightsaber and neglects things like willpower, but expects to just say that his character resists darkside temptations and keeps his extreme emotions in check, then yes. Not just rollplaying, but probably powergaming as well.
If the character has extreme stats to start, but plays it as a flaw and works towards improving it, then no. I'd need to play with a person for a bit to know that they'd play this type of character well before I'd allow it in a game. |
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Ankhanu Vice Admiral
Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 3089 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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Delkarnu wrote: | It depends, if the player boosts lightsaber and neglects things like willpower, but expects to just say that his character resists darkside temptations and keeps his extreme emotions in check, then yes. Not just rollplaying, but probably powergaming as well.
If the character has extreme stats to start, but plays it as a flaw and works towards improving it, then no. I'd need to play with a person for a bit to know that they'd play this type of character well before I'd allow it in a game. |
Yeah, those are huge distinctions... and very important. By my experience, however, probably 80%+ (educated guess, not a real statistic) of players fall into the former category. _________________ Hotaru no Hishou; a messageboard about games, friends and nothing at all.
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Esoomian High Admiral
Joined: 29 Oct 2003 Posts: 6207 Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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Ankhanu wrote: | Esoom and Del make pretty good points concerning the lacking stats Wookiees suffer from regarding Force use (and remaining light side, that is) |
I consider my argument to be based more on the Wookiees general temperament and racial background rather than the stats.
I've noticed that I have a tendency to min/max characters when I create them but the roleplaying is the part I enjoy most of any game, in my opinion it's also the most fun to see in a game when I'm GMing. A lot of my favourite gaming moments have been pointless interaction between characters and NPCs or groups of characters.
Hmmmm what was my point again? Oh yes, if done correctly stacking stats can lead to excellent roleplaying opportunities when the ace gunslinger has to make a simple mechanical repair but if done badly it can lead to the dreaded rollplaying. _________________ Don't waste money on expensive binoculars.
Simply stand closer to the object you wish to view. |
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