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Blind Hyperspace Jumps
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more I think about this, I think there need to be separate rules for blind jumps. Pretty much all the penalties and mishaps for normal jumps are the result of failed calculations where the ship goes off course. But in the case of an emergency blind jump, there are no calculations to screw up. I'm thinking a completely separate result chart, drawing from the Astrogation Mishap Table:
    -On most ships, the hyperdrive cut-out cannot be disabled without an Easy Repair Roll and 15 minutes. However, some ships (smuggling vessels and special missions craft) are equipped with an in-cockpit control that allows them to deactivate the cut-out as a Free Action. Naturally, such cut-outs are highly illegal, and are generally concealed as some other, nondescript ship's function in order to deceive inspections and customs agents.

    -Just spitballing some numbers, I'd say that a blind jump has a duration of 2D minutes, placing the ship at a random location in deep space. Calculating a new jump from that location adds +2D to Astrogation Difficulty.

    -Because of the disabled hyperspace cut-out, any Blind Jump result chart would have to include a very real chance of the ship colliding with a large object at hyperspace velocities, resulting in the instant destruction of the ship and all aboard. At a minimum, it would need to be a 1-in-6 chance on a 2D, so either as the 7 result, or as 2-4 or 10-12. Possibly more. Making it the result of a 2-5 or 9-12 increases the possibility very nearly to 1-in-3 (5 to 18). It needs to be high enough that PCs might chance it, but the first time they suffer a TPK will make them rethink it next time...

    -In addition, because a blind jump is linear and of short duration, it can be tracked and duplicated at Very Easy Difficulty by a pursuing ship.

    -In fact, I think I may make the TPK result on the upper end of the scale, with a modifier based on how long the ship stays in hyperspace on the blind jump. Like, for every extra 10 minutes, increase the Difficulty of being tracked and pursued, but also shift +1 up the result chart, toward TPK range.

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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 1:17 am    Post subject: Re: Blind Hyperspace Jumps Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
The current hyperspace rules focus almost exclusively on hyperspace jumps where the goal is to travel from one planet to another...

But what if your goal is simply to be anywhere other than where you already are, with no time to calculate?

Thoughts?


I don't think a Blind Jump is possible. Hyperspace Jumps require a destination. You can't just jump with no plan for exiting hyperspace. If you do, it is certain death.

Everything about the Hyperspace rules in the game support what I say here. Those rules are all based on having a destination.

You've got to be shooting for an exit point.

If you need one in a flash, then just pick a star, and go. You can correct course later, after you get to that star's system.

You may need to make a Hasty Jump.
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CRMcNeill
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, thanks for your input and have fun playing it that way in your own universe.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Well, thanks for your input and have fun playing it that way in your own universe.


LOL! Shocked
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Blind Hyperspace Jumps Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:

I don't think a Blind Jump is possible. Hyperspace Jumps require a destination. You can't just jump with no plan for exiting hyperspace. If you do, it is certain death.

Everything about the Hyperspace rules in the game support what I say here. Those rules are all based on having a destination.

You've got to be shooting for an exit point.

If you need one in a flash, then just pick a star, and go. You can correct course later, after you get to that star's system.

You may need to make a Hasty Jump.


I agree. IMO the nav comp won't even activate the hyperdrive without coordinates having been inputted. Hell the RAW even says if a person misses their astrogation roll by 10 or more, the nav computer spits out a "Hyperdrive won't engage" warning...
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But all of that is contingent on a hyperdrive cut-out that hasn't been bypassed or disabled.

Wadeb, garhkal has played this game with me before, so if you could, please show me either A) where it is written that the Star Wars films must define themselves on WEG's terms or B) where in the films it is definitively stated that all Hyperspace Jumps MUST be calculated.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My only problem with the idea of a "blind" hyperspace jump is that you need not just speed, but velocity... that is, your blind hyperspace jump has to have a heading, and blind jumps are probably set by duration, as well. You're not so much jumping "blind" as you are picking a heading and duration... blind jumps are those that take you beyond your sphere of astrogation data.


In fact, that's how I figure you explore new areas of space. Astrogate the hell out of where you are, looking for signs of mass shadows and the like, then blind jump That Way for 30 minutes. Then Astrogate the hell out of where you are, looking for mass shadows and the like, and, coincidentally, building up that initial map that will make the BoSS happy.

Maps of new places look like a high school model of a molecule... "Here's a sphere where we took a ton of readings... then the line where we didn't blow up... then a sphere where we took a ton of readings... followed by another line where we didn't blow up."
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Wadeb, garhkal has played this game with me before, so if you could, please show me either A) where it is written that the Star Wars films must define themselves on WEG's terms or B) where in the films it is definitively stated that all Hyperspace Jumps MUST be calculated.


You play your game the way you want, of course. But, if you're looking for opinion...

A) This forum is dedicated to the D6 Star Wars game, no? That's why answers are typically couched within that rule set.

B) It's not in the films, of course, but each time the Hyperdrive is shown in the films, a destination is being used. Not once has a ship jumped to nowhere/anywhere.



My idea of a "Blind Jump" is a ship making a Hasty Jump to some place the Navcomputer has coordinates for floating around in its memory. It could be from six months ago, or even the coordinates to some old moon from six years ago.

Just grab those coordinates and jump to them, without regard for updated information.

THAT seems like a likely Blind Jump in the Star Wars universe.
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BTW, I figured if any D6 book would have rules for "Blind Jumps" then it would be GG 8 Scouts.

I checked it. Nope. Nada. Nufin.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
BTW, I figured if any D6 book would have rules for "Blind Jumps" then it would be GG 8 Scouts.

I checked it. Nope. Nada. Nufin.

For the record, I do not consider myself or anyone else to be bound by WEG's limitations. While I enjoy the core system, it has its flaws, and is not a comprehensive window into the EU. I will not twist myself into knots trying to force the SWU to conform with something WEG published 25-30 years ago, and I will not hesitate to change any aspect of the RAW if I see the need to do so.

And WEG has explicitly granted me license to do so; read my signature.

In short, there is nothing on this forum as meaningless to me as the phrase. "You can't do that because the RAW says so," and any argument based solely on that phrase is invalid, as far as I am concerned. WEG is not the end-all be-all of the SWU, and should adapt to fit, not the other way around.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
For the record, I do not consider myself or anyone else to be bound by WEG's limitations. While I enjoy the core system, it has its flaws, and is not a comprehensive window into the EU.


Blasphemy! I say! Heretic! Say no Evil! Call the Enforcers!

(I'm totally kidding, of course. Wink )
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Bren
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enforcers nothing. Send for the Inquisitorius!










...He'll never expect them.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
CRMcNeill wrote:
Wadeb, garhkal has played this game with me before, so if you could, please show me either A) where it is written that the Star Wars films must define themselves on WEG's terms or B) where in the films it is definitively stated that all Hyperspace Jumps MUST be calculated.


You play your game the way you want, of course. But, if you're looking for opinion...


And since he made this thread looking for people's opinions on blind jumps, to just dismiss them by defaulting to the "films are canon, WEG is not", defeats the purpose of this thread..

So if that's the game CRM wants to play.. fine, i am done with this thread.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
And since he made this thread looking for people's opinions on blind jumps, to just dismiss them by defaulting to the "films are canon, WEG is not", defeats the purpose of this thread..

I'm pretty sure I just got done saying that I didn't consider "WEG doesn't allow that" to be a valid argument. And while I have been talked out of proposals in the past, I'm a little past that point when I'm posting an outline for a usable rule for blind Hyperspace Jumps. Wadeb may do what ever he likes in his campaign, but I'm looking for refinements to the basic idea, not to throw it out entirely.

Quote:
So if that's the game CRM wants to play.. fine, i am done with this thread.

Now, this reminds me of something...

Oh! That's it!
    garhkal wrote:
    Don't bother looking for me to make any further comments on ANYTHING OF yours.. Assuming i even open the d*mn thread.
I'm not worried; you'll be back.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 11581
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote:
Blasphemy! I say! Heretic! Say no Evil! Call the Enforcers!

(I'm totally kidding, of course. Wink )


LOL. Don't go giving g any ideas.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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