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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10297
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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JironGhrad
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 20 Jan 2016
Posts: 152
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 Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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That overconfidence can be a strength too though. There's a certain degree of psy-ops involved in the presentation of, "we are strong enough to be unafraid of you; we are so unafraid, that we want you to see us coming and know fear."
If the Emperor hadn't died, then the Empire could (and probably would have) pulled a U.S. Grant on Endor (for those unsure of the reference: General Grant fought a battle where he had the numerical superiority to lose 2.5 men per Confederate solider killed. He suffered significant losses foreshadowing the insanity of trench warfare in WW1.) |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2016 12:51 am Post subject: |
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I think we are getting ahead of ourselves.
For starters, while I like the idea of a modular weapon, there is no actual basis for it under the speeder bike's official description (as near as I can tell).
It's also important to remember that mission requirements will factor heavily into a vehicle's weapon systems. A speeder bike is designed as a skirmisher and information gathered, not an anti-vehicle assault platform. While I agree with the possibility of a modular system, my considered opinion is that an anti-vehicle assault version would be the exception, and that they would be few and far between.
Just for sake of comparison, here are WEG's stats for the speeder bike's laser cannon, adjusted to Character scale:Fire Control: 0D
Range: 3-50/100/200
Damage: 5D Based just on the stats, a character would be better served firing a Blaster Rifle than using this cannon...
I'm inclined to give it either a Light or Medium Repeater adjusted up 2D in scale, rather than trying to shoe-horn a blazooka into it (blaster bazooka = blazooka).
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14034
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2016 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: |
Just for sake of comparison, here are WEG's stats for the speeder bike's laser cannon, adjusted to Character scale:Fire Control: 0D
Range: 3-50/100/200
Damage: 5D Based just on the stats, a character would be better served firing a Blaster Rifle than using this cannon...
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Heck, that's the way for a LOT of canon/RAW vehicles..
Imperial waveskimer (operation elrood), speeder scale, 2D damage from its weapon so effectively a real long range blaster pistol that's harder to hit someone with.
Waveskimmer prototype (Alliance intel reports) speeder scale, 3d+1 medium blaster cannons (5d+1 effective vs characters).. Great range but only 1 pip more damage than a rifle.
Hoverscout, speeder scale, 2d damage laser cannon (same range as wave skimmers)..
QL-2A speeder truck, speeder scale, 3d damage defense blaster.. otherwise same as a rifle.
Storm skimmer patrol sled (Dark empires) 2 heavy repeating blasters, but only 5d+1 damage (7d+1 pc scale)...
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon May 02, 2016 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | Heck, that's the way for a LOT of canon/RAW vehicles.. |
All great examples, and the primary reason I'm proposing all these stat changes. My thinking is that, like the real world, it makes no sense to mount what are essentially character scale weapons on vehicles, IMO, the lightest blasters installed on vehicles should be light or medium repeaters.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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JironGhrad
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 20 Jan 2016
Posts: 152
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| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | My thinking is that, like the real world, it makes no sense to mount what are essentially character scale weapons on vehicles, IMO, the lightest blasters installed on vehicles should be light or medium repeaters. |
Except that "technically" almost all real world weapons ARE character scale. An M2 "Ma Deuce" .50 cal (seen on Humvees and the M1 Abrams) doesn't do more effective damage than a similar caliber Barrett sniper rifle. They only differ in quantity of effective damage, and, in some cases (the speeder bike comes to mind) how much "more" weapon can it really be size-wise than the comparative character weapon? How would a speeder bike, for example, carry around a weapon comparable to an E-Web, without also needing that bulky power-pack? |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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| JironGhrad wrote: | | Except that "technically" almost all real world weapons ARE character scale. |
Huh? There are quite a few tanks, missile launchers and artillery that don't qualify. You should rethink your proposition.
Upgrading the scale of a weapon to match the vehicle it is mounted on is a personal choice, and amounts to (in this case) nothing more than shifting 2D from Damage to Fire Control. If you feel it important that it should stay Character Scale, feel free to change it to suit your purposes.
| Quote: | | An M2 "Ma Deuce" .50 cal (seen on Humvees and the M1 Abrams) doesn't do more effective damage than a similar caliber Barrett sniper rifle. They only differ in quantity of effective damage, and, in some cases (the speeder bike comes to mind) how much "more" weapon can it really be size-wise than the comparative character weapon? How would a speeder bike, for example, carry around a weapon comparable to an E-Web, without also needing that bulky power-pack? |
Which is why I'm talking about putting a light or Medium Repeater on the speeder bike, not a heavy. The films make it clear that speeder bikes have enough onboard power to mount energy weapons; I'm just trying to work out what the best fit for that weapon would be.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14034
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 12:59 am Post subject: |
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| JironGhrad wrote: | | CRMcNeill wrote: | | My thinking is that, like the real world, it makes no sense to mount what are essentially character scale weapons on vehicles, IMO, the lightest blasters installed on vehicles should be light or medium repeaters. |
Except that "technically" almost all real world weapons ARE character scale. An M2 "Ma Deuce" .50 cal (seen on Humvees and the M1 Abrams) doesn't do more effective damage than a similar caliber Barrett sniper rifle. They only differ in quantity of effective damage, and, in some cases (the speeder bike comes to mind) how much "more" weapon can it really be size-wise than the comparative character weapon? How would a speeder bike, for example, carry around a weapon comparable to an E-Web, without also needing that bulky power-pack? |
For 'back up or small arms weaponry' sure. BUT i have been on some vehicles mounting 2-3 tow missile launchers, 40MM rapid fire grenade launchers. Those are not really 'character scale'..
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Zarn
Force Spirit
Joined: 17 Jun 2014
Posts: 698
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 3:02 am Post subject: |
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Heh, if the thermal detonator is character scale, then the Mk 19 is arguably the same - one being a pocket nuke, the other a belt-fed 40mm automatic grenade launcher.
And whatever D'harhan had as the top part of his body. Field artillery? |
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Dredwulf60
Line Captain
Joined: 07 Jan 2016
Posts: 910
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 3:50 am Post subject: |
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| JironGhrad wrote: | | CRMcNeill wrote: | | My thinking is that, like the real world, it makes no sense to mount what are essentially character scale weapons on vehicles, IMO, the lightest blasters installed on vehicles should be light or medium repeaters. |
Except that "technically" almost all real world weapons ARE character scale. An M2 "Ma Deuce" .50 cal (seen on Humvees and the M1 Abrams) doesn't do more effective damage than a similar caliber Barrett sniper rifle. They only differ in quantity of effective damage, and, in some cases (the speeder bike comes to mind) how much "more" weapon can it really be size-wise than the comparative character weapon? How would a speeder bike, for example, carry around a weapon comparable to an E-Web, without also needing that bulky power-pack? |
I'd say that neither the M2 nor the Barrett are 'character scale'.
Yes, they can be carried by a person, and shot at a person...but they are primarily meant to shoot at vehicles..or people within the protection of vehicles or other structures.
The M82 is designated an 'Anti-materiel' rifle.
It is the descendant of the large caliber anti-tank rifles of WWII.
The M2 is almost always mounted ON a vehicle or in a static position...and again it is useful when fired at people...but not as useful as the lighter machineguns, which would be more 'character scale', but it has the ability to rip up light vehicles and penetrate armor. |
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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OTOH, it gets a little weird with something like the E-Web, which is clearly intended to be anti-material, but is character scale... meaning it does effectively 6D speeder, with a +2D to hit.
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"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14034
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Dredwulf60 wrote: |
I'd say that neither the M2 nor the Barrett are 'character scale'.
Yes, they can be carried by a person, and shot at a person...but they are primarily meant to shoot at vehicles..or people within the protection of vehicles or other structures.
The M82 is designated an 'Anti-materiel' rifle.
It is the descendant of the large caliber anti-tank rifles of WWII.
The M2 is almost always mounted ON a vehicle or in a static position...and again it is useful when fired at people...but not as useful as the lighter machineguns, which would be more 'character scale', but it has the ability to rip up light vehicles and penetrate armor. |
Heck, my granddad (UK side) remembered working with some Russian troops in WW2, when they had a BBIIIIGG rifle, 25mm rounds. It needed 2 to carry.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | OTOH, it gets a little weird with something like the E-Web, which is clearly intended to be anti-material, but is character scale... meaning it does effectively 6D speeder, with a +2D to hit. |
Not too weird. Even with making my own version of the scale system, I've kept the scale levels close enough to make it harder to inflict damage across scale classes, not impossible.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue May 17, 2016 6:45 pm Post subject: |
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Just a quick update. I haven't forgotten about this, but I've been insanely busy fighting Darth Reality for the last three weeks. I'm home for three days, so I'm going to be focusing on wrapping the civilian vehicles Whill requested before moving on to the combat vehicles.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 11:16 am Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | Just a quick update. I haven't forgotten about this, but I've been insanely busy fighting Darth Reality for the last three weeks. |
That's a wonderful form of "I have been busy with life things". Bravo.
_________________
"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/ |
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