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Tactics: A New Old Approach
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:20 pm    Post subject: Tactics: A New Old Approach Reply with quote

I came across a 1E rule for the use of Tactics in the Rules Companion. The rules themselves were outdated (The "Haste" Rules got folded into Initiative and MAPs in 2E / 2R&E), but it did get me thinking about alternatives.

The bare bones version of what I'm thinking is this:
    -To use the Tactics skill, roll your skill level against either a flat Difficulty or against the opposing commander's Tactics roll.

    -On a success, refer to the following table:
      1-10 = Your unit / party receives a +1D bonus to Initiative.

      11-20 = Your unit receives a +1D bonus to Initiative, and may ignore 1D of MAP

      21+ = Your unit unit receives a +1D bonus to Initiative, may ignore 1D of MAP, and may redeclare its actions for that round after the enemy has declared theirs.

    Any bonuses last until either commander decides to change tactics, at which point the Tactics skill is re-rolled to generate a new result, which takes effect at the beginning of the following round.
Naturally, a Command skill roll would be needed to inform the unit as to the new tactic, but I just wanted to get this out there.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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Last edited by CRMcNeill on Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In situations of an opposed tactics check, do both re-roll their tactics, or does the opposition who is sticking to their tactic keep their previous roll?
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raven Redstar wrote:
In situations of an opposed tactics check, do both re-roll their tactics, or does the opposition who is sticking to their tactic keep their previous roll?

Both re-roll. This rule is derived from the Anticipate Enemy & Deceive Enemy aspects of Starship Tactics as described on pg. 45 of the 1E Rules Companion. So what happens is that, if one commander decides to re-roll his Tactics skill to attempt an alternate (and potentially more successful) tactic against an opponent, the opponent is also re-rolling his Tactics to Anticipate whatever new Tactic the enemy will come up with and come up with a counter-tactic of his own, with both sides hoping to deceive their opponent as to what they plan to do next.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolling Tactics against a set Difficulty would be more for pre-battle planning, with the Difficulty varying by the complexity of the tactical situation. For example, a starfighter raid against a sparsely populated planet defended by 4 TIEs and a System Patrol Ship would be a Very Easy Tactics roll, whereas a similar raid against a planet being defended by an Imperial Navy Superiority Force (Three Star Destroyers plus escorts) would be a Heroic Tactics roll or higher.

In addition, the GM could also throw a curve ball and have the declared Tactics roll be based on faulty intelligence, and the actual Difficulty is even higher. For instance, when planning a raid, the GM could tell the Tactics character that the base Difficulty is Very Easy, but withhold the information that an Imperial II will just happen to be passing through the system during their raid, which spikes the Tactics Difficulty by +10 up to Moderate, thus reducing any bonuses.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, and on a Tactics re-roll, Initiative is re-rolled at the beginning of the next round.
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like it! It's especially good for long running campaigns where characters may find themselves in command of a large number of troops or ships.
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are there existing rules for mass combat in D6 Star Wars?
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raven Redstar wrote:
I like it! It's especially good for long running campaigns where characters may find themselves in command of a large number of troops or ships.
Quote:
Are there existing rules for mass combat in D6 Star Wars?

I'm not aware of anything official, apart from the Miniature Rules. I don't think this skill was really designed for anything more than individuals or small groups. The only way I could see it working for mass combat is if you could find a way to treat a unit of troops or ships as a single entity for stat purposes. Maybe something like the Swarm rules from the D6 books would be a good starting place...
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Either way, imagine a PC rolling Tactics against a character like Thrawn, and the advantages this rule would provide to the troops under Thrawn's command...
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Either way, imagine a PC rolling Tactics against a character like Thrawn, and the advantages this rule would provide to the troops under Thrawn's command...


Oh, definitely!

Quote:
I'm not aware of anything official, apart from the Miniature Rules. I don't think this skill was really designed for anything more than individuals or small groups. The only way I could see it working for mass combat is if you could find a way to treat a unit of troops or ships as a single entity for stat purposes. Maybe something like the Swarm rules from the D6 books would be a good starting place...


I'll check out the swarm rules. There's a system in Green Ronin's A Song of Ice and Fire RPG. It uses a set of D6 rules. It might then just come down to statting out common troop types.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a similar note...
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2018 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I appreciate the simplistic rules for Tactics based on Starship Tactics in RC but adapted to 2e. Thanks.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an expansion on the above concept, has anyone ever considered making Tactics an Advanced Skill?

What I'm thinking is, make Tactics like the Engineering skill. Break it down into Starfighter Tactics, Capital Ship Tactics, Ground Assault Tactics, Small Unit Tactics, and so on and so forth.

Then make the prerequisites all related skills, plus Command. So, for Starfighter Tactics, make it 4D-5D each in Starfighter Piloting, Gunnery and Shields, plus Command.

Then, take the result chart from above and halve the result table, so the unit Commander rolls just his Tactics skill against the reduced Difficulty to generate advantages for the unit, like so:
    1-5 = Your unit / party receives a +1D bonus to Initiative.

    6-10 = Your unit receives a +1D bonus to Initiative, and may ignore 1D of MAP

    11+ = Your unit unit receives a +1D bonus to Initiative, may ignore 1D of MAP, and may redeclare its actions for that round after the enemy has declared theirs.

It's late, and I'm tired, but I just thought I'd throw it out there.
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Naaman
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is essentially what I have argued for for quite a while: the tactics skill providing bonuses rather than "information."

The whole point of superior tactics is to use your forces to the greatest possible effect while at the same time denying the enemy a chance to gain any traction in the fight.

Superior tactics manifest as a force that is greater than the sum of its parts, which, IMO, can only be reliably expressed in bonuses representing the troops exploiting advantageous circumstances, rather than information exploitation (which falls under the purview of intelligence, not tactics, anyway).

Basically, the "tactics" skill RAW would be more appropriately named "military intelligence" or some such, and would represent a character's specific knowledge of the enemy's capabilities, timelines, resources, etc.

With respect to the command roll, I still can't decide how I feel about tactics and command being different skills (when it comes to combat). To me, it feels like command should influence groups of groups, while tactics should affect groups of individuals (or just a single individual).
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps an Advanced Skill, with Tactics as a prereq, along with Command and appropriate combat skills? That way it's still possible for an armchair tactician with high Knowledge to understand the concept intellectually, but lacking in the real world application.

I'm looking at a write-up for Sokan, the Jedi art of using terrain and their surroundings to their advantage in a duel, and thinking of making it an (A) Skill, with 4D Tactics and 4D Lightsaber as prerequisites...
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

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